The CBB :: View topic - Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS

Well, I must send for Robin and tell her that she and Daisy are to be ready for Jack Maynard at half-past six. He's coming for them in that wonderful contraption of his, made of an old bath-chair, an aged tricycle, and rope. I warned him what would happen if he tipped either of them into a ditch on the way to Plas Gwyn, and he was most offended. He thinks that weird affair is better than any car that ever”

Neurasthenia was a term first coined by American psychiatrist George Beard in 1869 to denote a condition characterized by fatigue, listlessness, mental sluggishness and generalized aches and pains. Beard believed that this condition was due to complete exhaustion of the nervous system as a result of excess activity. Americans were believed to be particularly prone to neurasthenia due to their busy lifestyles.

The term was dropped from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders in 1980.

But in both cases, travel is seen as preventing a child from having a 'natural' life, which seems to be seen as strict routine, 'proper' lessons, meals and sleep at set times (ie. pretty much exactly a boarding-school routine).

I wonder why EBD took such a stringent view of what constituted a 'normal, healthy' childhood, and why she sees frequent travel as damaging and 'unnatural'?

The most "normal" family in the series, IMHO, are the Lilleys, but even they fall short of being ideal because Rosamund has to go to the local secondary modern and the education there is, according to EBD, not a patch on that at the CS.

I do think that one of the main themes of the series, especially the later books, is that no-one has an ideal childhood until they come to the CS.

I like it - it makes Lavender seem very human - but it always sticks out to me, particularly as I think there's a line about how it would have been better if the girls had told someone in authority what had happened. But there's never any payoff for it.

Her light brown hair was twisted into lank ringlets that just brushed her shoulders, and were tied up at one side with a big bow that matched her eyes.

a mane of reddy-brown hair, neatly combed off her face, and fastened at the nape of her neck with a big slide which allowed little curls and babyish rings to dance about an oval face.

Lavender got into bed, having deliberately omitted her prayers, and lay down, pulling up the bedclothes till all that could be seen of her was a mouse-brown head adorned with rubber curlers, for she still stuck to her ringlets.

Now, if only we could get rid of those awful curl-rag-made ringlets of hers, and get a little more flesh on her bones, she’d be quite like any other child who has led a normal life.

But it seems like splitting hairs (!) to distinguish between 'bad' curler-made curls and the natural curls of girls like Sybil, Robin and Alixe, which are always being praised - presumably they look much the same...? And clearly there's no actual rule against sleeping in curlers at the CS, or Matey would have enforced it?

I wonder what EBD thought of Irish dancers with their tight ringlets and lavish make up. Would she have approved because they are done to enhance the dance.

you just get Bill saying she thinks the curls look 'awful', which suggests that the CS just thinks it's evidence of poor taste, like the bright blue dress, or Joan Baker's scarlet braided number!

MJKB wrote:

I wonder what EBD thought of Irish dancers with their tight ringlets and lavish make up. Would she have approved because they are done to enhance the dance.

I remember the ringlets from the 70s as practically compulsory (I think now those are mostly wigs?), but I think the violent amount of make-up on very young dancers is a much newer thing, so I can't imagine EBD would ever have come across anything of the kind, should she have happened across Irish dancing. (Biddy does a jig or a hornpipe at some point for a school entertainment, doesn't she, but barefoot...?) They look absolutely horrifying and sexualised - and it's always seemed to me a very unsettling combination with the traditional dresses and the very chaste nature of Irish dancing.

I think her appearance is odd because ringlets are 'little girl' and Lavender is 13/14, tall for her age and older than the other girls in Lower 111

Quote:

I think her appearance is odd because ringlets are 'little girl' and Lavender is 13/14, tall for her age and older than the other girls in Lower 111

That's an interesting take on it, and one I'd not thought of, But it is true - a lot of Lavender's behaviour is presented as her being young for her age in a bad way (i.e. childish rather than the CS-approved 'keeping girls young' way)

Which is interesting in itself, because I'm not entirely sure where the 'good' principle of 'keeping girls young' ends and bad 'inappropriate childishness' begins - even look at the difference EBD clearly intends between Lavender's too-young ringlets and the older Alixe McNab's 'childish' natural curls (which are nonetheless seen as attractive to the point where even Lavender's aunt wishes Lavender looked more like her!)

Author:	abbeybufo [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 11:04 am ]
Post subject:	Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Lavender comes to the CS because her aunt is being called up into the ATS – this is one of the wartime books – and until this time, she has been travelling with this aunt, who has written a series about her ‘laughing’ in several different countries of the world. If you have not read the book, there is a synopsis here. The journey Lavender has now to make is that from a spoilt unhealthy child to a proper CS girl. Of course the war has put a stop to most travelling – Lavender and her aunt are no longer able to flit about the world, Mary Shand cannot get back to America, and petrol rationing has curtailed even local journeys. What did you think of the book – does it give a realistic picture of Lavender’s real and emotional journeys? Are the wartime travel restrictions covered accurately? Other means of transport, including Jack’s home-made cycle-rickshaw, are mentioned – did this interest you when you first read the books, and/or is it more interesting to us as adults? Other countries of the world are mentioned on several occasions, both in geography lessons and as places where various girls, Gay, Liliamani, etc. have their homes – did this make the book seem more exotic and interesting, or did it just pass you by? Please discuss these any other points you may wish to raise below. Next week’s book will be Highland Twins which will be considered in relation to the theme, Danger.

Author:	JB [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 11:42 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I do like this book; the Plas Howells books are my favourite part of the series and my edition of Lavender is a lovely, thick hardback (war economy edition printed on thick paper). It is, physically, a satisfying book to read. I feel very sorry for Lavender. She’s another of those girls who arrive at the Chalet School from a background which leaves them completely unprepared for boarding school life, along with Eustacia Benson, Ysuelt Pertwee and Edna Purdon in Oberland. They’re not naughty new girls like Cornelia or Emerence, yet they’re shown very little understanding and, even, it seems to me, blamed for being different. Margot Maynard, brought up perfectly by Joey (!), is treated more gently when she throws a bookend at someone, than these girls who have had a difficult upbringing. Lavender is unwell and on the point of suffering serious nervous problems but by the evening of the first day in school, the staff are complaining about her, without considering why she might be like this or giving her any time to settle down. Over the course of the term, she settles down very well, going from the girl who has a tantrum because she’s not allowed to keep all her dresses to one who wants to share those dresses with Lillamani. I admire her spirit in phoning a wire to her aunt for permission to give the clothes away and her thoughtfulness in giving up a fun holiday with the Marilliars to stay with Lillamani at the Dragon House. I do find her “journey” realistic and it happens without any very dramatic incidents (apart from falling in a snow drift). She is basically a nice girl whose initial behaviour is perfectly understandable and who finds her feet, with the help of some good friends. It’s a shame she virtually disappears from the series after this. I like the EBD’s portrayal of the younger girls here – Bride and Julie, and their friends. This is such a contrast to the later books when EBD fails to make three-dimensional characters out of a group of friends eg Jack Lambert’s gang. Miss Leigh is a good comic character – the scene with Bill is hilarious – but I think it was a very good thing for Lavender to get away from her. I did wonder if EBD had a really series of books in mind when she came up with the Lavender Laughs idea. Bill and Julie Lucy’s comments on them are cutting. Jack’s rickshaw has always made me smile, largely because of the description of his pride in it because he built it himself. There is a strong feel of wartime in this book but in a less dramatic way than in the previous book (Highland Twins). Mary Burnett’s parents have been bombed out and we see the effect of petrol rationing on the small, day to day journeys. In a rural area, everyday life must have taken a lot of planning and distances so much greater than they are today.

Author:	Liz K [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Having only the Armada paperback, this is the first I've heard of Jack's rickshaw bike. How much is cut from the pb please?

Author:	ChubbyMonkey [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I'm pb only, as well. I can see I'm going to have to learn more about this rickshaw! This book was always evidently one of my favourites, however, just because it's one of the newest I own but falling apart anyway I used to really like the story, even as a small child, and my love of this book has never really faded in the way some others have. I do like Lavender - not at first, when she's quite different to the pleasant girl we see at the end. Particularly I always liked her argument with Bride, it was always such a realistic incident for me (possibly having a very similar friendship with someone at the time!) Her character is interesting, I think, because other girls who've done a lot of travelling in the series don't seem to be as 'bad' as she is - for example Joey, who even when showing Grizel around Paris manages to be quite pleasant. Whereas Lavender seems to think that it makes her better than the other girls in some way, which IMHO is realistic, especially in a time when almost all travel would be off, but isn't very pleasant! I agree that it's nice to see the younger girls, especially in such a lovely friendship

Author:	abbeybufo [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I don't know that it is called a rickshaw anywhere, but here is the description: Quote: Well, I must send for Robin and tell her that she and Daisy are to be ready for Jack Maynard at half-past six. He's coming for them in that wonderful contraption of his, made of an old bath-chair, an aged tricycle, and rope. I warned him what would happen if he tipped either of them into a ditch on the way to Plas Gwyn, and he was most offended. He thinks that weird affair is better than any car that ever”

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Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS http://www.the-cbb.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7336

Author:	JB [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I wonder if EBD knew someone who'd made one of these? It seems an unusual thing to imagine if she hadn't seen one.

Author:	Alison H [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think the storyline about Miss Leigh having to join up's a bit unconvincing: mothers of children under a certain age were exempt from conscription, and in practice surely this would have been extended to aunts, sisters (e.g. Shiena McDonald?) or other relatives who were responsible for children whose mothers weren't living. It would have been impossible otherwise: only a small minority of people would have had the money for boarding school fees. Having said which, I think the Leighs are interesting. At one end of the spectrum, we have Jacynth's aunt, who pretty much sacrifices her own life to look after her niece. At the other end, we have people like Captain Humphries, who just dump their children whilst they go off and do their own thing. We have people who leave their children at boarding school because they genuinely believe that it's what's best for them whilst they themselves are working abroad. Miss Leigh doesn't give up her own career, but she takes Lavender with her. So Lavender's seen and done some very interesting things, much more exciting than sitting in a classroom learning that x plus y equals z, but her education is lacking in many areas and she's not used to interacting with other children. So which is the best way? I do feel quite sorry for her: for example, she gets her head bitten off for criticising the Peace League, even though she's only saying what most people would have thought at the time, she's treated as if she's abnormal because she doesn't want to join the Guides, and how was she supposed to know that the best desk was reserved for the form prefect? That happens in a lot of schools, and indeed workplaces: you're expected to know what that place's own "little ways" are and you're treated as if there's something wrong with you if you think/do/say anything different, because people who've been there a long time are so institutionalised. I wish we'd seen more of Lilamani. Like Naomi, Yseult and various other people, she's brought in for one book, has the potential to be a very interesting character but then is written straight out again.

Author:	Sunglass [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I'm always interested in the doctor's diagnosis of 'neurasthenia' (not a term that's used any longer in modern psychiatry) and his specific linkage of it to the 'unnatural' life of travel that Lavender has led until the age of thirteen. Quote: Neurasthenia was a term first coined by American psychiatrist George Beard in 1869 to denote a condition characterized by fatigue, listlessness, mental sluggishness and generalized aches and pains. Beard believed that this condition was due to complete exhaustion of the nervous system as a result of excess activity. Americans were believed to be particularly prone to neurasthenia due to their busy lifestyles. The term was dropped from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders in 1980. The way Dr Marillar talks about Lavender's health is very similar to the way in which forestalling the threat of TB is talked about in earlier CS books - he tells her aunt that if she doesn't send Lavender to school where she can have a routine, healthy meals and sleep and live a 'heedless, normal' life, she'll have a 'nervous invalid' on her hands for life. I suppose Lavender is a forerunner of Carola Johnstone, who also travels endlessly with an 'unwise' aunt, but with the difference that Carola is a reluctant traveller, who's sick of being 'on the go', and is dying to go to school. But in both cases, travel is seen as preventing a child from having a 'natural' life, which seems to be seen as strict routine, 'proper' lessons, meals and sleep at set times (ie. pretty much exactly a boarding-school routine). I wonder why EBD took such a stringent view of what constituted a 'normal, healthy' childhood, and why she sees frequent travel as damaging and 'unnatural'? Other CS characters like Joey appear to have done a lot of travelling and not had many young friends before their CS days, without it being seen as necessarily 'unnatural' or bad...? She seems to be essentially saying that incessant travel has made Lavender mentally ill, down to nervous spasms, twitches etc!

Author:	claire [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:22 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think once the child is over a certain age (which I thought was 14 but maybe 13 if Lavender is that age - or her aunt is thinking ahead as she will be soon) the woman had to do some form of war work - not forces, but something. Miss Leigh doesn't seem like the sort of person who could deal with staying in one place so could see her choosing the forces over a factory

Author:	ChubbyMonkey [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:12 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Sunglass wrote: But in both cases, travel is seen as preventing a child from having a 'natural' life, which seems to be seen as strict routine, 'proper' lessons, meals and sleep at set times (ie. pretty much exactly a boarding-school routine). I wonder why EBD took such a stringent view of what constituted a 'normal, healthy' childhood, and why she sees frequent travel as damaging and 'unnatural'? There was an interesting article on the BBC today, which in part said that children with a routine, set bedtimes etc were likely to do better than their peers who didn't have one. It just struck me that it ties in with EBD's idea that travelling stops a child getting a good education, and I can imagine that it must have been quite stressful to be on the go constantly! I can see some benefits in living a quiet life, with your friends around you and always knowing roughly what the next day will hold so that you don't have to worry about it.

Author:	Llywela [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:25 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think that idea also ties in with the Cutting Edge documentary I saw last week on young children being sent to boarding school - the families featured were all army families who believed that the stability of both home and education offered by boarding school would be better for their youngsters than the constant disruption of army life, being uprooted all the time and having to move to new homes and new schools whenever their fathers were sent to a new base. It's the same principle behind the BBC article you mention and EBD's idea that children were better off at school than travelling constantly. And it is certainly true that children need stability, although it can come in a variety of forms.

Author:	Alison H [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think EBD does have a point there. We sometimes see references to people having been taught along different methods to those used at the CS: whilst the point is usually that the CS is wonderful and other schools are not, different schools do follow different syllabi, if not different methods, and so it's very difficult for anyone who keeps having to change schools. Then there are the issues of friendships and stability generally. Having said which, I'm not sure that travelling around a lot would cause neurasthenia . I do think that one of the main themes of the series, especially the later books, is that no-one has an ideal childhood until they come to the CS. Sorry if that sounds sarcastic: it's not meant to. In some cases it's because it just can't be helped, e.g. because parents are ill or working abroad, but in other cases it's just because life at home apparently just isn't as good as life at the CS. Before coming to the CS, Joey is always ill, Mary-Lou gets little chance to make friends, Emerence is allowed to run wild, Barbara Chester is cosseted too much, Eustacia is encouraged to be priggish, etc. The most "normal" family in the series, IMHO, are the Lilleys, but even they fall short of being ideal because Rosamund has to go to the local secondary modern and the education there is, according to EBD, not a patch on that at the CS. Claire, I think the age was 14, but, as you say, Miss Leigh could have done some other form of war work rather than joining the forces. Maybe she just told Lavender she had to join up because she didn't fancy the idea of working in a factory or an office!

Author:	RubyGates [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Alison H wrote: The most "normal" family in the series, IMHO, are the Lilleys, but even they fall short of being ideal because Rosamund has to go to the local secondary modern and the education there is, according to EBD, not a patch on that at the CS. Not just according to EBD, a secondary modern in the 50s couldn't have compared with a private school. They were very much looked down on by grammar/high school kids as well. My husband passed his 11+ but his brother didn't. His brother spent all his life feeling like he wasn't quite as good as my husband and was for ever trying to "catch up" with him. I've met other people who were the only ones from their families to go to a secondary modern and they had always been made to feel inferior.

Author:	Sunglass [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Oh, I agree, routine is probably a good idea, but travel making you mentally ill to the point where your doctor says you're headed for a life of complete nervous prostration sounds a bit far-fetched! All the 'nervous twitching', extreme pallor, and jerking we're told Lavender has at the beginning makes it sound as if she has shell-shock or something... And Elisaveta is also made ill and listless by her unnatural childhood at Court, but in her case, it's because of too much routine and sameness. Alison H wrote: I do think that one of the main themes of the series, especially the later books, is that no-one has an ideal childhood until they come to the CS. That's certainly true. Even if Lavender's childhood could actually sound fairly idyllic - a devoted (if silly) aunt who genuinely loves her, seeing interesting places, being famous - compared to some of the childhoods EBD does present as normal and desirable. (I'm never convinced of the happiness of growing up in a crowded Die Rosen/Round House nursery, for instance...)

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Author:	Llywela [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Maybe it is the pressure of fame that is Lavender's real problem, rather than the lack of routine in her life!

Author:	Mel [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I suppose Lavender was mildly famous and acclaimed by her aunt's fans, both adults and children. Her life would be largely sedentary with all the travelling which is very tiring and tedious for a child. Also it sounds as though she kept the same hours as her aunt and was introduced to rich food and Turkish coffee! To be dropped into the CS where she is taller and older looking than the other girls, she discovers that they are not too impressed by who she is, and her education does not stand up to real questioning. Also she persists in a fancy and forbidden hairstyle, is competely unfit for sports and has few skills in dealing with well-meant advice and mild teasing. No wonder the poor girl is miserable and bad marks to the staff for not being more tolerant - except Biddy who is kind.

Author:	Nightwing [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
One of the things that interests me about Lavender is the scene where Lavender confronts Joy Bird after the snow fight. In so many CS books, the wronged girl in that sort of situation will forgive her attacker, and they may even go on to become friends; both girls learn an Important Lesson and go on to become much happier girls. But that isn't the impression I get here. Lavender doesn't really seem to forgive Joy Bird - she doesn't tell on her because she wants to 'stand on her own feet'. And Joy remains somewhat suspicious of Lavender's motives; while she decides that she's going to work harder and pull herself up she certainly doesn't seem any nicer for it. I like it - it makes Lavender seem very human - but it always sticks out to me, particularly as I think there's a line about how it would have been better if the girls had told someone in authority what had happened. But there's never any payoff for it.

Author:	MJKB [ Tue Feb 16, 2010 11:41 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Nightwing wrote: I like it - it makes Lavender seem very human - but it always sticks out to me, particularly as I think there's a line about how it would have been better if the girls had told someone in authority what had happened. But there's never any payoff for it. Maybe EBD intending taking it up later and just forgot. She was always doing that, starting a thread and then leaving it. I do agree with you that it makes for greater realism than the usual scenario. I love this book and would have enjoyed more of Bride Bettany and her gang who are, imho, quite the nicest group of girls in the series. Plas Howell days almost pip Tyrol days for me.

Author:	Pado [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 1:43 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Wasn't there also some magical hair cutting involved in Lavender's transformation as well?

Author:	Alison H [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:01 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Ooh, I'd forgotten about that. Yes, Lavender decided to cut her own hair because it was very long and kept getting caught in things. Hair cutting also seems to play a big part in the lives of Ted and Simone, and Mary-Lou has two significant changes in hairstyle (abandoning the Kenwigses and then her hair becoming curly after her accident) which both seem to mark the start of new stages in her life. Joan Baker's perm growing out is seen as symbolising her change from Unsuitable Girl to CS girl. &, of course, in the early days putting your hair up is a sign of becoming a young adult rather than a child. Hmm. Having said which, if you had to wear uniform pretty much all the time, and weren't allowed to wear make up, your hairstyle'd be one of very few ways of expressing any sort of individuality. & changes in fashionable hairstyles, not that anyone at the CS seems to be into those, can say a lot about the times - women having short hair rather than "feminine" long hair in the years after the First World War, long "hippy" hairstyles in the '70s, "big" hair with lots of lacquer in the '80s, etc - and so are often used as a way of expressing other things. Or maybe EBD just liked the story of Samson and Delilah and thought that changing someone's hairstyle was a way of changing their personality!!

Author:	Sunglass [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:25 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think in the case of Lavender's hair, EBD also has a rooted objection to curls that aren't natural (as she can never quite forgive Joan Baker for her perm) -- poor Lavender's artificial curls seem to be some kind of symbol of her 'unnatural' pre-CS life: Quote: Her light brown hair was twisted into lank ringlets that just brushed her shoulders, and were tied up at one side with a big bow that matched her eyes. whereas a couple of lines later, EBD clearly approves of Alixe McNab's natural curls - Quote: a mane of reddy-brown hair, neatly combed off her face, and fastened at the nape of her neck with a big slide which allowed little curls and babyish rings to dance about an oval face. It seems entirely possible to me that the curls are Lavender's aunt's idea, rather than her own, and that it's in loyalty to her that she keeps on with them after she goes to the CS, but EBD still seems to want to blame her for them, by (in a CS world of strikingly-coloured hair) making hers both an ordinary colour and suggesting it makes her skip prayers to attend to her curls: Quote: Lavender got into bed, having deliberately omitted her prayers, and lay down, pulling up the bedclothes till all that could be seen of her was a mouse-brown head adorned with rubber curlers, for she still stuck to her ringlets. Bill certainly sees the artificiality of her curls as a signal of her lack of 'normality': Quote: Now, if only we could get rid of those awful curl-rag-made ringlets of hers, and get a little more flesh on her bones, she’d be quite like any other child who has led a normal life. So Lavender embraces 'normality' when she does a Simone and chops her hair off. But it seems like splitting hairs (!) to distinguish between 'bad' curler-made curls and the natural curls of girls like Sybil, Robin and Alixe, which are always being praised - presumably they look much the same...? And clearly there's no actual rule against sleeping in curlers at the CS, or Matey would have enforced it?

Author:	Tor [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 11:05 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Quote: But it seems like splitting hairs (!) to distinguish between 'bad' curler-made curls and the natural curls of girls like Sybil, Robin and Alixe, which are always being praised - presumably they look much the same...? And clearly there's no actual rule against sleeping in curlers at the CS, or Matey would have enforced it? Rag-curls rarely look the same as natural curls, as they are too even, and straight hair rarely has the 'bounce' to it that cury hair does, but I think that this is by-the-by to EBDs opinion. I think it has more to do with implying too much interest in ones appearance, than the look of the curls; at this stage EBD is still (I think) making the point that young girls are more akin to young boys, and frowns upon any affectation of vanity - particularly in the young (beyond being clean, neat and 'trig' of course ). This brings up EBDs opinions on beauty, which I find fascinating and slightly contradictory. I think she generally feels that people shouldn't try to affect styles/looks that aren't natural to them, but that as adults they should 'enhance' their natural look by the judicious application of powder etc. So truly 'natural' isn't ok, but neither is artificial....

Author:	Mel [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 11:49 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Also, girls who do have long hair or lovely curls should frequently complain about it in case they should be thought vain e.g 'for two pins I'd cut it all off!' This of course elicits cries of horror. Marie, Biddy and Jo all do this. In CS isn't the use of powder to cover a shiny nose rather than effort to make oneself prettier? Yet they constantly are pleased with pretty frocks to suit their colouring, and devise fancy dress in pretty mode, such as angels, fairies, flowers etc. Except 'characters' like Corney who doesn't care!

Author:	ChubbyMonkey [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 12:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
You've made me get very self-conscious about my hair now! I have naturally straight hair, but whenever it's wet I put it into plaits to stop it from dripping all over the flat/my bedding - so I usually have curly hair during the day. Please don't disapprove of me for it! I'd second Tor's suggestion that it's the fact that Lavender spends so much time on them that makes it a problem. I think that EBD thinks you are supposed to make yourself presentable, but anything more is vanity - which I suppose was a compromise to the fact that at least some of her characters could, realistically, be expected to go on and become debutantes, so they would have to know how to manage their looks. Climing mountains and playing lacrosse is just a far better use of your time!

Author:	ammonite [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 2:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Isn't it also that putting her hair into rags for the night would be uncomfortable and she probably won't sleep as well leaving her tired the next day. This could be part of the problem that Dr Marillar sees, that she is constantly tired and he hopes school which is unlikely to allow fancy hair styles and insist on regular hours of sleep will give her better habits and show it isn't about artificial beauty but beauty through being lively and natural.

Author:	MJKB [ Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I wonder what EBD thought of Irish dancers with their tight ringlets and lavish make up. Would she have approved because they are done to enhance the dance.

Author:	Sunglass [ Sun Feb 21, 2010 8:09 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
MJKB wrote: I wonder what EBD thought of Irish dancers with their tight ringlets and lavish make up. Would she have approved because they are done to enhance the dance. I remember the ringlets from the 70s as practically compulsory (I think now those are mostly wigs?), but I think the violent amount of make-up on very young dancers is a much newer thing, so I can't imagine EBD would ever have come across anything of the kind, should she have happened across Irish dancing. (Biddy does a jig or a hornpipe at some point for a school entertainment, doesn't she, but barefoot...?) They look absolutely horrifying and sexualised - and it's always seemed to me a very unsettling combination with the traditional dresses and the very chaste nature of Irish dancing. I have to say that, with all her faults, Lavender never strikes me as vain of her looks, and I have a hard time imagining her deciding to curl her hair herself - as others have said, trying to sleep in curlers, curl-rags, or rollers of any kind is agony, and putting them in is time-consuming. I imagine the artificially-maintained 'mane of curls' is very much Auntie's idea of what her niece should look like, and that Lavender keeps doing it at school initially out of loyalty to her, and also because, like other 'problem' new girls who have often led fairly solitary lives, it doesn't occur to her that she is supposed to make an effort to merge into the collective, so she doesn't see the problem with wanting her usual number of dresses, or curling her hair, because that's what she's always done. I do think EBD was a bit doctrinaire about how girls and women choose to present themselves, anyway - she never seems for a second to acknowledge that her own preference for the 'fresh and dainty' is just that - a preference. Or acknowledge that other kinds of look, whether that's Beatnik or Mrs Pertwee's or Lavender's aunt's 'arty' dress might just be a legitimate different preference, and not plain 'wrong'! I appreciate that the school might legitimately have concerns about the curlers affecting Lavender's sleep, but no one ever says that - you just get Bill saying she thinks the curls look 'awful', which suggests that the CS just thinks it's evidence of poor taste, like the bright blue dress, or Joan Baker's scarlet braided number!

Author:	MJKB [ Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:19 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Sunglass wrote: you just get Bill saying she thinks the curls look 'awful', which suggests that the CS just thinks it's evidence of poor taste, like the bright blue dress, or Joan Baker's scarlet braided number! I have to say that Joan Baker's scarlet affair did sound pretty awful. And one gets the impression that she piled on the thick, heavy make-up that was around then. The 50's fashion for dressing young girls like older women seems pretty ghastly now. Like Sunglass, Lavender never comes across as particularly vain. She probably wears her curls out of loyalty as many people have remarked. That should have picked up by the authorities and seen as a positive quality in the child. Biddy O'Ryan comes out extremely well in this book. I like the way she correctly identifies the flak against Lavender as approaching bullying.

Author:	Sarah_G-G [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:59 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Sunglass wrote: MJKB wrote: I wonder what EBD thought of Irish dancers with their tight ringlets and lavish make up. Would she have approved because they are done to enhance the dance. I remember the ringlets from the 70s as practically compulsory (I think now those are mostly wigs?), but I think the violent amount of make-up on very young dancers is a much newer thing, so I can't imagine EBD would ever have come across anything of the kind, should she have happened across Irish dancing. (Biddy does a jig or a hornpipe at some point for a school entertainment, doesn't she, but barefoot...?) They look absolutely horrifying and sexualised - and it's always seemed to me a very unsettling combination with the traditional dresses and the very chaste nature of Irish dancing. I have to admit, I've always wondered what the CS girls would have made of ballroom dancing if they carried it on at university. I suspect EBD would have been very disapproving of the competitive circuit had she ever come across it as it's very far removed from traditional folk dancing, which is what she always seems to place ballroom along side. Quite apart from the fact that most ballroom dancers do standard Latin dances as well, and the fact that girls would have to dance with young men, the make up worn is frankly scary and the dresses would definitely count as vulgar most of the time! If you search "ballroom 1970s" on youtube you can see the dresses on that and they are just hilarious! Women on the circuit aren't supposed to look particulary pretty and "trig," they're made up to look striking and noticeable and pretty much as far removed from ordinary people as possible. From the minute you step out onto that dance floor you're not a woman, you're a female dancer and competitor and that is how you're dressed. Back on topic, I do feel sorry for Lavender when the staff are criticising her appearance just because it really doens't seem as though it's her fault as such, or that it's what she desperately wants. Admittedly I haven't re-read this one in a while, but she's only about 10, isn't she? She's wearing things she's been told to wear and styling her hair as she's been told it should be styled. I could understand it better if the comments were along the lines of "she looks like a little doll" (in the way that people comment on Meg's appearence in Little Women when she is persuaded to let Sally and Belle dress her up for that ball), but "lank ringlets" suggests that the problem is that with her hair like that, Lavender just isn't very pretty, which seems like a bit of a harsh criticism on a 10 year old's appearance.

Author:	Mel [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think her appearance is odd because ringlets are 'little girl' and Lavender is 13/14, tall for her age and older than the other girls in Lower 111.

Author:	Emma A [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
It seems rather odd that the theme of this discussion is about travelling, since all the travelling done by Lavender (and her aunt) occurs off-screen! It being a wartime set book, no-one else really travels at all, either - due to petrol rationing and bad weather. Not meaning to be picky, but it's just occurred to me

Author:	JB [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
That's fair enough, Emma. I think in our original notes about themes it made sense because (ostensibly) a lot of Lavender's problems have been caused by travelling eg her nervous problems and her difficulty fitting in with other girls. We did try to get a balance between themes - it would have been all easy to put everything under "Change" or "Friendship". Your comment made me go back to look at the notes, which has been really helpful.

Author:	ChubbyMonkey [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
Sorry, Emma I think that it was originally me who suggested it, the rationale being that a lot of Lavender's problems seem to be put down to her travelling by EBD - so that she doesn't know how to get on with others/is always languid etc.

Author:	Tor [ Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Books: Travelling – Lavender Laughs at the CS
I think that rather than not putting it under the theme of 'travelling' that juxtaposition makes it interesting. So don't apologse Ariel - I don't think that was what Emma was saying (not that I want to put words in her mouth ). The original title, after all, was a play on the 'travelogue' books written by Lavender's aunt, and ultimately a lot of the interesting aspects of travelling relate to experiencing a kind of culture-shock to varying degrees. Lavender certainly got that at the CS! But, given the war-time restrictions on travel, and given the previous 'exotic' appeal of the CS stories, perhaps this book was actually a little manifesto for saying home is as exciting and good for you as all those exotic places forbidden to you at present. Or some such thing... as EmmaA says, its interesting that EBD chose to have a seasoned traveller as her main character, and chose to give the book that stylistic title. Quote: I think her appearance is odd because ringlets are 'little girl' and Lavender is 13/14, tall for her age and older than the other girls in Lower 111 That's an interesting take on it, and one I'd not thought of, But it is true - a lot of Lavender's behaviour is presented as her being young for her age in a bad way (i.e. childish rather than the CS-approved 'keeping girls young' way)