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Danger- Princess
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Author:  Fiona Mc [ Sun May 02, 2010 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Danger- Princess

The Princess of the Chalet School was the third book to be published in the Chalet School series and was published in 1927. It is moderately abridged and was reprinted twenty-five times. The later reprinting of the hardbacks weren’t abridged, so it is possible to get the full copy of the book quite easily on the internet.

In brief, this book covers the two terms of Princess Elisaveta at the Chalet School. We also see Juliet Carrick as Head Girl and the inclusion of a new staff member: Matron Webb. Matron Webb rouses the hatred of the girls and they start a society, SSM: The Society of the Suppression of Matron. We also see Elisaveta kidnapped by a mad cousin and Joey Bettany’s subsequent rescue of her. The book finishes with Joey being honoured in Belsornia for her bravery.

The theme we are discussing in relation to this book is danger. There are several aspects to this. We have the obvious danger to Princess Elisaveta herself with her kidnapping and to Joey Bettany when she went after her and attempted to rescue her.

We also have the danger to the school and its reputation with Elisaveta’s kidnapping. Madge briefly alludes to this to Prince Carol who reassures Madge that Joey’s bravery more than nullifies Elisaveta being kidnapped. We also hear later of pupils being attracted to the school because it had had Princess Elisaveta as a pupil (Thekla).

We also have the danger of hiring new staff for the school without being met by the owner/headmistress of the school. Matron Webb detrimentally affects a number of girls at the school with her abuse in power especially towards the Robin by locking her in the cupboard. Matron Webb could have also been a danger to the continued running of the school in her defiance of Madge. Madge’s authority had never been tested by another staff member quite like this.

Please discuss this and any other events or instances that relate to the theme of danger.

Author:  Sarah Carr [ Sun May 02, 2010 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

There is also the danger of the girls going off without permission/notification, though Jo does leave a note for her sister.

Author:  Fiona Mc [ Sun May 02, 2010 1:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Welcome to the board Sarah! :D I notice that's this is your first post. You're right, I hadn't thought of that one to add in.

Author:  emma t [ Sun May 02, 2010 5:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Princess is one of my favourite books of the seriel, and I don't tire of reaching for it again and again :) The aspects of the book are well written, and the danger of the school's reputation is one that I had never actually thought of before - the Chalet School always seems to be so popular, even in the early days it grows like fun (to quote Joey!).
There is a great deal at steak here. Any wrong word set against the school would certainaly have potential parents of future pupils thinking twice about sending their daughters to a school who allow such things to happen,but yet, at the same time, the school staff at large cannot be held responsible for a pupil going off in the middle of the night when one is sleeping - even if there are prefects in the said dorm - parents know what young children are like, or ought to do :mrgreen: thus said, it ends happily and maybe Prince Carol and the king recomended the school to members of their family, and friends of also as a way of thanking them- over the top I know, but it's a thought!
The danger to the girls themselves was certainly obvious. Elisaveta knew the maddness of her cousin was well know amongst the Belsornians; and though she had 'king and country' well rubbed in from an early age, common-sense would have told her that a man she did not have much to do with would not come and get her in the middle of the night and in secret. There was constant danger to the two girls as they went off (Joey in persuit) and relief when they were reunited with Madge and Jem.

Author:  Nightwing [ Sun May 02, 2010 9:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

emma t wrote:
The danger to the girls themselves was certainly obvious. Elisaveta knew the maddness of her cousin was well know amongst the Belsornians; and though she had 'king and country' well rubbed in from an early age, common-sense would have told her that a man she did not have much to do with would not come and get her in the middle of the night and in secret.


Admittedly it's been ages since I read this book, but it was always my understanding that Elisaveta doesn't know that it's her cousin she's going off with. Cosimo's man introduces himself with a (forged) letter explaining that he's her bodyguard, and while Madge doesn't entirely trust him, the letter and the fact that she'd been expecting such a person make her publicly accept him. Elisaveta knows that he's her bodyguard, and that there's always the threat that Cosimo may come after her, and so when she's told that she has to leave school in order to prevent that happening, of course she goes. I can't really blame her for going. Joey, of course, should have gone to Madge to tell her what was going on, but for all she knew Elisaveta's 'bodyguard' had perfectly legitimate cause for taking her off.

If anyone was at fault, I'd say ultimately it was Veta's father for sending her off across the world without a bodyguard in the first place...

Author:  Abi [ Sun May 02, 2010 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Nightwing wrote:
If anyone was at fault, I'd say ultimately it was Veta's father for sending her off across the world without a bodyguard in the first place...


Yes, I always thought it was rather careless of him, once he knew Cosimo was a danger to her, to entrust her to Madge, who is a very young, fairly inexperienced woman who is running a school, not a bodyguard service. There really shouldn't have ever been any question of blame for Madge!

I love Princess - Elizaveta herself is lovely and it's great the way she throws herself into school life. As for Matron Webb, she is splendidly nasty and it's interesting to see Madge's authority being challenged in a very direct way. You can feel the shock that her attitude sends through the school and, as one of the staff I think says at the time, maybe it's even a good thing for their assumptions to be challenged a bit.

Author:  Pado [ Mon May 03, 2010 2:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

There's also the danger of drinking directly from those clear mountain streams, as I believe Joey does when she and Rufus settle in for the night. Clearly, one should keep a thermos of lemonade handy for such middle of the night excursions!

Author:  Artemis [ Mon May 03, 2010 6:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Yes - having wild camped in some interesting places, the danger of those clear mountain streams is that there's often a dead sheep a couple of pretty pools further upstream . . .

Do I need to go into the sick factor of actually discovering this? Or the delights of bathing in one of those deep, clear mountain pools and discovering something - squishy - at the hidden bottom of one with your cold, naked, toes . . .?

And then there's the burdock leaf issue. True, if you have omitted to take toilet paper - and I'm sure Joey and Elisaveta did - then burdock leaves are handy to have around. But they're not as resilient as TP. And they're not always around.

Sorry, this is a bit facetious :( But I am serious about the dead sheep!

Author:  Sarah Carr [ Mon May 03, 2010 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Fiona Mc wrote:
Welcome to the board Sarah! :D I notice that's this is your first post. You're right, I hadn't thought of that one to add in.


Yes, thank you for the welcome, Fiona (or are you a "Fauna" -*twinkling eyes*)

Since they are always so "carefully supervised," I wonder at Grizel running away, Simone finding enough time to hack off her hair, etc...

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Mon May 03, 2010 11:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

I've only just read the uncut version of this one for the first time, and it's changed my impression of it quite a bit, though it's always been a favourite of mine - the full version is a much stronger novel, which is nice to know!

As regards the 'danger' of hiring the wrong kind of staff member, the uncut version makes is quite plain that part of Matron's unsuitability for the CS (apart from the obvious locking up the Robin stuff) is a social unsuitabilty -- which means that the whole Matron interlude at the beginning makes much more sense in relation to the Elisaveta plot. One of the reasons Madge asks Joey to keep an eye on Elisaveta is because E, as a princess, 'will never have met anyone like Matron before', and it's true that Elisaveta's denunciations of Matron for scolding Joey are about ideas of being a 'lady' or being 'common':

Quote:
'She actually told me that I was no lady to speak as I did!’ declared Matron, who, truth to tell, rather bore out the validity of Elisaveta’s accusation by her present manner


Quote:
Then Elisaveta got angry too, and she said Matron hadn’t the – the instincts of a lady, or she wouldn’t have said such things – it was only canaille who spoke so.


'Canaille' is pretty pointed in the circumstances, especially from a Princess - it means 'rabble'! And EBD seems to agree that part of the problem with Matron is that she is common - the whole 'imitating Matron's loud voice' thing again makes much more sense in the uncut version, where it's not just that the girls' shouting disturbs the peace, but that the authorities fear they are learning 'common' ways of speech from Matron! Mademoiselle tells the girls when they imitate Matron's voice in public that they are making 'as much noise as the peasants at carnival time... It is not well for you to make visitors think that we of the Chalet School are rude – rough – noisy.’ And Miss Maynard is horrified at what the Belsornian royals would think if they could hear Elisaveta talking so loudly and using 'vulgar slang' which she allows Madge to think she picked up from Matron. (I also don't remember from the paperback quite so much emphasis on how much the school has worked on encouraging the girls to speak in soft, ladylike tones!)

In fact, the whole book is more socially conscious than I remember the paperback being - I remember Joey saying that a princess pupil would be a jolly good thing for the school, but not her suggestion that it would look good if the Crown Prince would allow her to use his name in the prospectus, or the discussion about letting her come incognito, though obviously an aristocrat of some kind:

Quote:
‘Ask them to let her come as an ordinary girl, then,’ suggested Joey. ‘If she just seems to be what Wanda calls Hochgeboren, they won’t think half so much of it. We’ve got two or three like that now, so they’re getting more used to it.’
There was a good deal of sense in what she said. If some of the girls knew that the newcomer was a princess, there was no doubt that it would cause a good deal of trouble, for many of the girls came from Austrian families which were strong Imperialists; and these girls had, as the young headmistress had said, an almost exaggerated idea of rank. On the other hand, there were several children at the Chalet School who came from the lesser nobility, and another such girl would make no difference to them.


Which also makes more sense of the Bolshevik references and Elisaveta's pronounced hatred of Russians. I also don't remember from the paperback the explanation for why Maurus Ternikai is so firmly in Cosimo's power, or the reference to family blood-feuds still happening in Belsornia!

Author:  emma t [ Mon May 03, 2010 4:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Nightwing wrote:
emma t wrote:
The danger to the girls themselves was certainly obvious. Elisaveta knew the maddness of her cousin was well know amongst the Belsornians; and though she had 'king and country' well rubbed in from an early age, common-sense would have told her that a man she did not have much to do with would not come and get her in the middle of the night and in secret.


Admittedly it's been ages since I read this book, but it was always my understanding that Elisaveta doesn't know that it's her cousin she's going off with. Cosimo's man introduces himself with a (forged) letter explaining that he's her bodyguard, and while Madge doesn't entirely trust him, the letter and the fact that she'd been expecting such a person make her publicly accept him. Elisaveta knows that he's her bodyguard, and that there's always the threat that Cosimo may come after her, and so when she's told that she has to leave school in order to prevent that happening, of course she goes. I can't really blame her for going. Joey, of course, should have gone to Madge to tell her what was going on, but for all she knew Elisaveta's 'bodyguard' had perfectly legitimate cause for taking her off.

If anyone was at fault, I'd say ultimately it was Veta's father for sending her off across the world without a bodyguard in the first place...


Thanks Night Wing for pointing this out, I think I went wrong there a bit - time for a re-read, me thinks! :)

Author:  Alison H [ Tue May 04, 2010 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

I'd find the Ruritanian princess storyline ridiculous later in the series, but somehow it works in Tyrol ... although the number of rescues carried out by Joey in the first few books does get rather ridiculous, and seeing as Elisaveta is 2 years younger than Joey (which is a big difference at that age) it would have made more sense for her to pal up with Margia, Evvy & co and give someone else the chance to play the heroine ... or even to have the sense to alert a mistress about the problem!

I think the Matron Webb storyline is interesting, and very realistic. Madge doesn't have time to carry out interviews herself because she's got so much on, uses an agency, and ends up saddled with someone she doesn't like - it's an easy mistake to make, and it's good that EBD lets Madge makes mistakes rather than turning her into an infallible Head as she sometimes seems to want to do with Hilda. Whilst Matron has no business being rude to her boss, it's also realistic that a member of staff would resent taking orders from someone who is young, inexperienced and has no formal qualifications. & I like Madge's wedding :D .

Does anyone think that EBD got a bit too obsessed with Guides in this book, though? I've nothing against Guiding, I hasten to add, but it seems to crop up every couple of pages and it's meant to be a school story, not a Guides story.

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue May 04, 2010 9:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Alison H wrote:

Does anyone think that EBD got a bit too obsessed with Guides in this book, though? I've nothing against Guiding, I hasten to add, but it seems to crop up every couple of pages and it's meant to be a school story, not a Guides story.


The Guides bit that amuses me is that when Elisaveta's father comes to watch Elisaveta being enlisted

Quote:
the Guides gave an exhibition of company drill which impressed him very much. Not even the men of his own regiment, seasoned veterans as most of them were, could show greater smartness. The girls were even and precise in their movements, timing it all beautifully.


Now, I can imagine EBD intended the CS Guides to be very good at drill, but is she actually expecting us to believe that the Prince really thinks that a group of teenage girls, most of whom can't have been Guides for long, are better than his own regiment of professional soldiers? :D

Also, when Elisaveta swears allegiance to 'God and the King', is she swearing allegiance to the King of England or to her grandfather?

The other thing I don't remember being in the paperback is it being very explicit that Joey and Grizel are growing apart because of Grizel becoming a prefect and being swollen-headed about it - and also, slightly oddly, that despite how much we see them together in the SSM, playing tennis and on expeditions, and the age similarity - and that Margia is always presented as a fun, popular, likeable character - that Elisaveta doesn't like Margia, and prefers Joey!

Author:  Mel [ Tue May 04, 2010 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

I love the early Tyrol books, but I find when reading this one that it does focus too much on Elisaveta and we don't get much else. I wonder why EBD made E younger than Jo? There seems no reason for it as Jo would have looked after the princess at any age.

Author:  Nightwing [ Wed May 05, 2010 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Alison H wrote:
...it would have made more sense for her to pal up with Margia, Evvy & co and give someone else the chance to play the heroine ...


I do sort of get the impression that it's not an equal friendship. Jo is one of the only people who knows Veta's true identity, and she seems to feel something of a responsibility towards her because of that; while Veta's feelings for Jo verges on adoration at times. I think their friendship is a lot more natural in Camp, by which stage Jo is a lot closer to Frieda, Simone and Marie and Veta does seem to spend more time with Margia et al.

I agree that it would have been nice for someone else to rescue someone for a change! I'm having visions of a group of Middles taking out Cosimo Home Alone style :lol:

Author:  Alison H [ Wed May 05, 2010 9:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

It doesn't seem like a very equal friendship later on either. Poor Elisaveta is constantly going on about how Joey's her best friend, and she even asks her to be her chief bridesmaid and later on names one daughter after her and another daughter after Madge and Robin, but most of the time they all seem to forget about her. It's not unrealistic, especially once Elisaveta's left school and Joey is carrying on normal school life with Simone, Marie, Frieda and everyone else, but it's sad :( .

Author:  Miss Di [ Thu May 06, 2010 12:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Danger- Princess

Poor old 'Veta, I can see why she sees Joey as her BFF but Joey has other interests and other friends too. 'Veta goes back to Belsornia where her companions are ladies in waiting - not natural friends who just see her as another person.

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