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Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
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Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Sun May 23, 2010 2:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Audrey, Solange, Val, Celia and Winifred (usually called Win) are schoolgirls staying on the Platz to be near sick relatives. Bored, and trying to entertain themselves, they decide to build a Campfire. Unfortunately, they do it within the grounds of the Chalet School, and are scolded by Miss Dene.

After this, and an encounter with Len Maynard, the group declares war on the Chalet School. Their tricks try the patience of staff and students alike.

The girls play a variety of tricks on the Chalet School including blocking the path during a school walk, throwing stinkbombs at the prefects and spreading pepper on the food in the Speisesaal.

Over time, the girls come into contact with pupils, ex-pupils and school events. This helps change their attitude towards the Chalet School. And when Win goes missing, it's the Chalet School that saves the day.

Meanwhile, the Fifth Form sits GCE exams, and an ex-Chalet schoolgirl faces an uncertain future.

From The New Chalet Club website.

'Wins the Trick' is the book which perhaps deals most with adult matters through the series. All five of the main new characters are, in some way, connected to a relative at the San.; for Solange, death looms near, while Audrey has to face up to her father's illness and how close tragedy has come for her family. As well as this, Mary-Lou also has to face death with the passing of Commander Carey, leaving her family shattered.

How do you feel that EBD deals with adult matters such as illness in this book, both compared to other books in the series and in general? For a children's book, do you think that there is a lot of talk of death and illness – too much, perhaps? Does it move the focus away from the school?

In this book we also get to see Audrey start to grow up, and have a discussion with her mother about finances, another very adult matter. Does this strike you as realistic? What do you think of EBD including it in the book?

Finally, and to move away from the theme to the general, what do you think of the book as a whole? Did you enjoy it? Is it about the school, or is it about the five girls – or both? Do you think that things such as EBDisms are more prominent in this book, or that the plot is perhaps a slight re-working of the much earlier plot involving the Mystic M, or do you enjoy it as a strong book?

Please discuss these and any other issues relating to 'Wins the Trick'. Next week: Family: 'Jo Returns'.
Author:  JB [ Sun May 23, 2010 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I don’t know if I’d agree that Wins the Trick is the book that deals most with adult matters but, to me, it definitely feels more modern than many of the others. Audrey and her friends even wear jeans. :shock:

It isn’t the first time we’ve seen girls face the death of a close relative; many of the girls at the school in Tyrol were there because they had relatives at the San and earlier in the Swiss years we had a scene by the sick bed of Leila Elstob. However, we very rarely see the strain that the practicalities of moving abroad with a sick relative can have on the rest of the family. When Mrs Linton has to move to Austria at the drop of a hat, there’s no problem with money, housing or getting the girls into the Chalet School whereas here we see poor Mrs Everitt dealing with a couple of teenagers and a bratty small child, while worrying about money. I think the conversation between Audrey and her mother about money is handled well in a fairly typical EBD way in that a parent has hidden things from their child and there’s understandable frustration from the child. I can’t help but wonder if this was how EBD felt about her own childhood.

I wouldn’t have said there’s too much talk of death and illness or not compared to the Tyrol books at any rate (or Jacynth’s Auntie in Gay from China) but it’s unusual for this point in the series when the links between San and school aren’t as prominent.

Quote:
Len saw further into the future than she did. “I’m sorry for Verity and Auntie Doris,” she returned in the same low tones, “but the one I’m sorriest for is Mary-¬Lou. I’ll explain later.”
There was no time for more. The second bell rang as she ended and silence fell. But the girls prayed very earnestly as they had been asked.
Later, when the younger ones had gone to bed and the Seniors were out in the garden, Len’s own clan gathered round her and Con asked what she had meant.
“I know she’ll be sorry, but after all, it isn’t as if Uncle Roland had been her own father,” she said. “I think it’s worse for Verity.”
Len stared at her. “Oh, don’t you see?” she burst out. “This may mean the end of Mary-Lou’s career!”


I think it’s very sad that Verity is an afterthought here. The poor girl has lost her father (and only blood relative) yet Mary Lou is the person for whom everyone feels most sorry. I’m sure EBD meant us to think that Con is being unperceptive (did I just invent that word?) but I agree with her. Rikki Fry, in particular, is really rude saying that Verity will be “disgustingly selfish” if she doesn’t pull herself together and help Mary Lou. I do think it’s difficult for Mary Lou but she still has her mother and I find this response of Len’s to be overly dramatic.

This book isn’t one of my favourites and I think it’s a complete rehash of the Mystic M storyline, although written more from the point of view of the outsiders than the school, perhaps something which contributes to it being a fairly weak book IMO. I find it hard to believe that the school couldn’t help out and take the 5 girls, even as day pupils, especially given the links between school and San. The following term, they can fit in a whole school after the fire at St Hilda’s! Even if they’ve had building work done over the summer, they’d surely have filled the extra space with new pupils.

I do like the way Len deals with the gang when she meets them before the start of term but the comments from the latter about “foreign schools” who play cricket with a soft ball are a rehash of the Saints’ views in Rivals.
Author:  Alison H [ Sun May 23, 2010 5:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Sorry to be negative but I think that this is one of the weakest books in the series. Whilst it's nice to see Rosalie taking centre stage for once, the CS playing a sports match against a team from another school and, yes, some people actually doing public exams :lol: , the feud storyline is pretty much a rehash of the Mystic M storyline. Also, the Camp Fire references totally confused me until I read EJO's Camp Fire books! The storyline with Audrey and her mother is one of its better aspects, though: it's interesting to see someone being aware of the practical problems of upping shop and moving to the San.

I don't like the way that the Carey family issues are dealt with. Verity just seems to be overlooked, as Janice says, and we see other people discussing Mary-Lou whereas it would've been more interesting had we seen Mary-Lou herself wondering whether she should abandon her career to be a companion to her mother (had Doris been in poor health at this stage, Mary-Lou would presumably have felt that she had little choice, but she wasn't, so there were arguments either way) or whether she should carry on with her university course, and possibly seeking advice from Joey and or Hilda. This was published at the start of the '60s, as social attitudes were entering a period of big changes, and EBD had the quintessential CS girl faced with a decision as to whether to do what earlier generations would probably have considered right or whether to "do her own thing" ... and instead she just sidestepped the problem by bumping Doris off a few books later! I think it was a missed opportunity for some very interesting scenes.
Author:  Fiona Mc [ Mon May 24, 2010 1:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I tend to agree with Alison it would have been really interesting to see from ML's perspective and her conversations with people about it all. I do think Len and co are a bit harsh with Verity especially as I could see ML insisting on staying with her Mother regardless of what Verity said. ML has seen first hand what it was like to have her Father gone and then to find out his death. I could see her quite happily going off if Roland was still alive but I think she would feel guilty while he's dead. Verity could offer and could actually be around for Doris but I could see ML seeing it as her responsibility or rather not wanting to leave it to someone else no matter how close that person was. I certainly don't see ML doing it because Verity is too selfish not to do it as Len says. (I am curious as to whether EBD would portray Con and Margot as being selfish if Joey died in the train crash in Summer and looking after the kids was left to Len, as Joey planned).

I do think it's interesting we see what it's like for a family, where going to Switzerland wasn't as cheap and easy as it seemed for some and we do see the cost on a family where it is a struggle. I likt the conversation between Audrey and her mother. I think it's very understandable, that Audrey wasn't particularly aware of what was going on and that her Mother didn't discuss this with her until she asked. What I do find very tactless of Joey is she broke the information about the Everett's going to the Chalet School. Mrs Everett was in an awkward position as she either had to laugh it off or get upset with unknown ramifications. I would have preferred to see Joey being pulled up for it, but can see why Mrs Everett didn't.
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Mon May 24, 2010 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
This one always makes me wonder whether the Swiss CS actually had any walls or fences, let alone a gate with a sign that says 'Chalet School'! Not only do Audrey and co not notice they're on a cricket pitch at the start, but then Audrey apparently accidentally wanders into the school grounds again on her own without intending to and gets escorted out by Josette!

I get frustrated with this book, because in some ways the plotline is a strong one. OK, it's a Mystic M rehash, but the fact that it's a group of older girls, who are running wild on the Platz because of seriously ill relatives at the San, is plausible, and it's good to get a hostile outsider's take on the school for once! EBD does sidestep some of the possible drama, though - why have Val and Celia ruin a meal with pepper on the day the CS is playing a visiting school at tennis and very much putting on its best face for the strangers - but not have it take place while the visitors are still there, waiting to be fed? And losing Win twice is a bit odd.

On the adult matter of facing serious illness - I think EBD handles it oddly here. Everyone - including total strangers! - seems to know, and freely discuss, enormous amounts of detailed information about Solange's aunt, Audrey's father and Val's brother's illnesses, so we aren't primarily inside the minds of teenage girls starting to realise how sick their family members are. It blunts things a bit, as well as being outrageously unprofessional - assuming the news is trickling out to the CS staff via Jack and Joey! I rather like gruff, mixed-up tomboyish Audrey, but I find it a bit implausible that it has never occurred to her until now to wonder about the family's finances, or precisely how ill her father is. I sometimes think EBD does think children live on a different planet!

(incidentally, I do think it's terrible that Mrs Everett bluntly tells Audrey her close friend's aunt is dying, when Solange herself doesn't know - I think that's an unecessary burden for Audrey to carry, rather than anything to do with household finances...)

I agree with what others have said above about the outrageousness of the way in which Verity's father's death is greeted by the CS, as if Verity hasn't just lost her only close relative, and Doris her husband - but rather as if they are both simply helpless, clingy obstacles to Mary-Lou's archaeology career! The thing Rikki says about 'disgustingly selfish' and what Con says about Verity having to teach at a school near Howells are both nosy, 'ill-bred' and ungenerous, I think - the whole discussion needed someone to come in and tell them to keep their noses out of private affairs and stop speculating. And for Margot, who specialises in temper tantrums, violence, threatened blackmail and blaming her imaginary devil for her ill deeds ( :shock: :D ) to say 'What's wrong with Verity?' and accuse her of being moony and soppy just blows my mind!
Author:  Nightwing [ Mon May 24, 2010 11:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Cosimo's Jackal wrote:
...and what Con says about Verity having to teach at a school near Howells are both nosy, 'ill-bred' and ungenerous, I think...


Was this cut out of the pb? Only I don't remember it! *needs to reread, obviously*

I actually really enjoy this book, mostly because of Audrey.

I don't find her lack of awareness about her parents' finances that surprising. Presumably she's grown up in a family which has been fairly well off while her father was working; she's probably not used to thinking about how much things cost, or wondering where the money has come from. At the beginning of the book she seems to lack awareness generally - she doesn't think about the consequences of her actions of lighting a fire, or how the younger children will take it if she declares a grudge against the school. At the same time, she does have a sense of responsibility for them, especially for Win, of course. She's basically caught between childhood and adulthood, and in that way I think she's one of EBD's best drawn teenagers, at least in the later books.

I also like that, unlike the Mystic M, they're not actually one cohesive group. Audrey is essentially the 'leader', but we see that Solange, probably her closest friend, isn't really interested in carrying a grudge. Val and Celia are 'typical naughty middles', but the pranks they play are pranks they know that Audrey won't approve of. And while Win's too young to really be part of the group, she's the only one who blindly follows Audrey.

The one part of the book that really makes me roll my eyes is the houses at the Sale - it's nice that Tom has inspired a whole class of kids to build dolls houses, but it seems like total overkill to have a dozen dolls' houses - not to mention the logistics and expense of getting them to Switzerland in the first place...
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Nightwing wrote:
Cosimo's Jackal wrote:
...and what Con says about Verity having to teach at a school near Howells are both nosy, 'ill-bred' and ungenerous, I think...


Was this cut out of the pb? Only I don't remember it! *needs to reread, obviously*


I don't know if it was cut. It's during the general conversation about what Mary-Lou will do after Commander Carey's death:

Quote:
"Oh, well, if she can stick out things in the face of everyone ticking her off, perhaps she'll face this business now and do what she can to help Mary-Lou," Ruey said optimistically.
"If she doesn't, she'll be disgustingly selfish, I think," Rikki commented severely.

and
Quote:
"Verity's going in for singing, isn't she?" Sue Mason asked.
Len nodded. "Yes; she means to teach, but she'll have to go to the Royal College of Music first. That's all arranged. When she has her A.R.C.M., I think she'll try to get a job in a school. She's not good enough to go in for concert work. I mean her voice isn't big enough. But she can teach and that's what she means to do."
"Let's hope she doesn't get a school miles away from Howells!" Con said sharply.


I think that's definitely outside any legitimate 'butting in' - it seems to me to be nosy, and frankly, in bad taste, on Con and Rikki's parts, to be making fairly hostile speculations about poor Verity, who's just lost her father. There's no reason at all, after all, to assume she's not going to find a local teaching post, or is going to 'let' Mary-Lou give up her career on her account.

Though I always feel like pointing out that Verity is Doris's stepdaughter - and hasn't in fact been her stepdaughter for very long - how long were Roland Carey and Doris married before he died? - whereas Mary-Lou is her biological daughter. Surely if it's really necessary for someone to give up her career, or be the one to have to try to find work locally to Howells, Verity is the less likely candidate of the two...?

I'm also never entirely sure what Len and co mean when they keep going on about how Verity and Doris are the most 'helpless' pair, who won't be able to 'manage' alone. Because sometimes it just sounds like they're (understandably) grief-stricken and not coping, but other times it sounds as if what EBD means is that they simply can't cope with running a household in practical terms - someone asks how Doris coped when Mary-Lou's father was off in the Amazon, and Len says that old Mrs Trelawney 'ran them', which makes it sound like a house-keeping issue.

I think the reason Audrey's apparent cluelessness about the Everett finances seems implausible to me is that EBD makes it clear that there wasn't much money (by CS standards) even before Mr Everett got ill. He only had his salary as a bank cashier, which is peanuts by EBD's standards, and Audrey knew that, because she had asked if she could go to boarding school at some point, and been told her parents couldn't afford it.
Author:  Fiona Mc [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Quote:
Though I always feel like pointing out that Verity is Doris's stepdaughter - and hasn't in fact been her stepdaughter for very long - how long were Roland Carey and Doris married before he died? - whereas Mary-Lou is her biological daughter. Surely if it's really necessary for someone to give up her career, or be the one to have to try to find work locally to Howells, Verity is the less likely candidate of the two...?


I tend to agree. It would be like asking Ruey to give up her career plans to take care of Joey so the triplets can happily pursue their career plans with an easy consience. I don't think Len and co really know what it's like to lose someone close or even to have to make any kind of sacrifice like that for family. I can't see Mary Lou wanting to put that kind of responsibility onto someone else, especially not when she see's it as her own responsibility.

BTW Doris and Roland Carey annouce their engagement when Bride was Head Girl, so it was probably that summer they got married, which would make it about five years or so.
Author:  mohini [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I somehow did not like this book.
I wondered how anyone could enter the school grounds to light a fire.
The conversation between he triplets and Rikki is only meant to show deep understanding nature of Len and emphasize ML's OAOO status.
Surely Commander Carey must have been well off or am I getting confused. The house described in Three go to seems quite a mansion.
The book on the whole seems unrealistic except for few events.I find the conversation between Audrey and her mother about finances realistic.
I did not ever like the Mystic M and find the idea tricks played very unreal.
And if the girls were going to the school from next term they should have been informed about it. Why the secrecy?
Author:  2nd Gen Fan [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I'm with the body of people who don't think much of the book - it is definitely one of the weaker ones, and I particularly dislike the discussion of Mary-Lou and Verity's future.

But I am with Nightwing in finding Audrey one of EBD's best drawn teenagers - the mixture of childishness and elements of responsibility and the dawning understanding of the real world of finances all ring true for me. And she wears jeans! :shock: :D
Author:  JB [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
mohini wrote:
The conversation between he triplets and Rikki is only meant to show deep understanding nature of Len and emphasize ML's OAOO status.


I think it fails totally in achieving the the former!

mohini wrote:
Surely Commander Carey must have been well off or am I getting confused. The house described in Three go to seems quite a mansion
.

That's a really good point. It does sound like a huge house and when Verity marries, Mary Lou says about the china she's inherited (several dinner services of Crown Derby, etc) and that she's buying her a "modern, fireproof set". I don't think there'd be any reason the family couldn't afford to pay for a housekeeper for Doris.
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Fiona Mc wrote:
It would be like asking Ruey to give up her career plans to take care of Joey so the triplets can happily pursue their career plans with an easy consience. I don't think Len and co really know what it's like to lose someone close or even to have to make any kind of sacrifice like that for family. I can't see Mary Lou wanting to put that kind of responsibility onto someone else, especially not when she see's it as her own responsibility.

BTW Doris and Roland Carey annouce their engagement when Bride was Head Girl, so it was probably that summer they got married, which would make it about five years or so.


OK, the marriage was longer than I remembered, but even then - and despite the fact that Verity and Doris are clearly fond of one another -the fact that Verity is in a foreign country at boarding-school for most of that period wouldn't mean they got to know one another as well as if Verity lived permanently at home, so Verity's relationship with Doris could never even approximate Mary-Lou's. And I agree that Mary-Lou would have felt her mother was her own responsibility, not Verity's, no matter what Verity was like as a human being. (And that's a good point about it being perfectly financially possible for a housekeeper to be hired!)

There's one other thing in that conversation I always find really interesting. Part of it is relevant to the idea of adult matters, though part of it's more to do with the ideas of teenage obedience being discussed on another thread. It's the bit where Len is telling the others about old Mrs Trelawney being the authority in the household during her lifetime:

Quote:
' I know Mary-Lou thought the world of her and really looked up to her. She can't exactly look up to Auntie Doris. It's Auntie who will look up to Mary-Lou now.


This strikes me as unusual in the CS books for overturning the usual 'obedient daughter looking up to good parent' hierarchy. Here, it matters less that Doris is Mary-Lou's mother than that her lack of strength of character makes it impossible for Mary-Lou to 'look up' to her - in fact, Mary-Lou is in charge of her parent, because she is the stronger character, and this is seen as natural - and we're told it by saintly Len!
Author:  Alison H [ Tue May 25, 2010 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I think that's really rude, actually! Len is quite right - Doris seems like a rather helpless type who would definitely be ruled by Mary-Lou rather than the other way round - but it's not a very appropriate thing for a teenager in CS-land to say about an adult. A few books later, we get the triplets saying - to Hilda! - that they think Nancy's the only person capable of being Acting Head whilst Hilda is away: it may be true, but again it's not really an appropriate way for them to speak. I suppose it's just EBD using them to tell us what's going on, in the same way that she makes Jo seem like a horrendous gossip by using her conversations with friends to tell us about other people's private business, but it doesn't sound right :? .
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue May 25, 2010 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Alison H wrote:
I think that's really rude, actually! Len is quite right - Doris seems like a rather helpless type who would definitely be ruled by Mary-Lou rather than the other way round - but it's not a very appropriate thing for a teenager in CS-land to say about an adult. A few books later, we get the triplets saying - to Hilda! - that they think Nancy's the only person capable of being Acting Head whilst Hilda is away: it may be true, but again it's not really an appropriate way for them to speak. I suppose it's just EBD using them to tell us what's going on, in the same way that she makes Jo seem like a horrendous gossip by using her conversations with friends to tell us about other people's private business, but it doesn't sound right :? .


I agree it's pretty rude! To say someone else's mother isn't the type to whom her daughter could look up strikes me as outrageous by CS standards, unless the mother in question is pretty villainous, like Ted Grantley's mother, or Mrs Carrick. And the bit where the triplets discuss the failings of possible replacements for Hilda always blows my mind! Sure, it's so we know what's going on, but surely EBD could have written it so that the triplets discuss who the replacement might be among themselves, rather than with Hilda! I know she's an awkward combination of 'Auntie Hilda', next door neighbour and family friend, and Headmistress, but it seems way out of line to me to allow school pupils to assess your colleagues' suitability to be acting Head. And different to the much more understandable inclusion of Joey in various early CS decisions, when Madge was her mother/sister, as well as her Head, and her home was the school.
Author:  MJKB [ Tue May 25, 2010 3:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Where on the way did Mrs. Trelawney, who in the early days seemed like an average type of mother, and Verity Carey, become so clingy and helpless? Generally speaking one of the strenghts of the CS series is that most of the characters are consistent over a very long period of time, but in Verity's case she changes from being a force to be reckoned as a very young child with into this weak, hopeless adult. And what is to stop Mrs. T employing a companion and making a new life for herself? She is still fairly young when her second husband dies, the illness which eventually kills her hasn't manifested itself at this point, she has been used to a quiet household having sent both girls to boarding school, so why does she need one of them to nanny her now? I find it amazing that women like Doris and Mrs.Winterton, whose husbands up and leave them to pursue their careers in foreign parts, and who appear perfectly capable of managing their lives as single mothers, then find it impossible to cope when their children attempt to leave home.
Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Tue May 25, 2010 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
MJKB wrote:
I find it amazing that women like Doris and Mrs.Winterton, whose husbands up and leave them to pursue their careers in foreign parts, and who appear perfectly capable of managing their lives as single mothers, then find it impossible to cope when their children attempt to leave home.


Actually, I can sort of see why. With their husbands away, I can imagine them clinging to their children as the vestiges of their family, and placing all their reliance on them, so that when the children try to leave it feels like the abandonment of their husbands all over again.

...Or perhaps I've just been studying psychology too much!
Author:  JB [ Tue May 25, 2010 5:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
ChubbyMonkey wrote:
Actually, I can sort of see why. With their husbands away, I can imagine them clinging to their children as the vestiges of their family, and placing all their reliance on them, so that when the children try to leave it feels like the abandonment of their husbands all over again.


Or the opposite can be true in families where one parent has had to manage everything on their own. I know a few families where the husband/father has struggled to deal with the difference in the family dynamic after long absences working away.

In fiction, there's a great instance of this in Michelle Magorian's Coming Home, when the father returns after years away at war and the mother has trained to be a mechanic in one of the women's services.
Author:  clair [ Tue May 25, 2010 5:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Strangely this was when I first became interested in Len and her role. Her comment, to me, was far more about herself. What she said about ML and her career - surely that must have been her greatest fear, something happening to Joey and Len then expected to look after them for the rest of her life! No wonder that was Len's comment, she knew just how she'd be feeling - bet she was longing to escape into the real world by then!
Author:  sealpuppy [ Tue May 25, 2010 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I don't know that it happens so much now, but when I was in my teens (50s-early 60s) it seemed to be a fairly common occurrence for a 'little wifie' kind of woman to blossom once her 'strong and manly-type husband' had popped his clogs. I remember my mother and grandmother commenting on it several times on the lines of: there goes another one!

I see no reason why Doris couldn't have been another, if she'd been given the chance and it strikes me she might have been shaking in her shoes at the prospect of ML abandoning her career to 'take charge'. Besides, Verity was probably much more of a companion to Doris than ML, more restful and congenial. I'd shudder at having to be looked after by someone who is described as having a 'breezy' manner, especially allied to ML's legendary lack of tact. (Oops, I mean ML's habit of being 'just our Mary-Lou'.)

A nice little bungalow with a housekeeper and Verity visiting frequently, might have suited Doris down to the ground.
Author:  MJKB [ Wed May 26, 2010 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
sealpuppy wrote:
A nice little bungalow with a housekeeper and Verity visiting frequently, might have suited Doris down to the ground.


You're so right! But unfortunately, people tend to make the same mistakes and follow the same pattern over and over again. Poor Doris, she gets rid of Old Mrs. Bossy Knickers Trelawney and marries the nice, mild mannered Commander Carey. Probably for the first time in her life she has a significant other who actually needs her rather than the other way round. And then he dies and she faces the prospect of the return of old Mrs.T in the guise of her grand daughter, the, admitedly kind, but interfering, breezy, bracing Mary-Lou. No wonder she takes the option available to her .....oblivion.
Author:  Nightwing [ Wed May 26, 2010 9:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
sealpuppy wrote:
...especially allied to ML's legendary lack of tact.


I think you're confusing her with Joey... Mary-Lou is interfering, loud and bossy, but she's never presented as being particularly lacking in tact!
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Thu May 27, 2010 9:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
The thing that strikes me is that we're told about Doris's helplessness far more than we actually see it in action! Obviously, we don't see a lot of her anyway, but the only times where we see her dealing with her strong-minded daughter and being a bit helpless are in Three, where she's in poor health, and it's obvious that her mother-in-law calls all the shots in the household, clearly having decided that Doris isn't capable of bringing up her own child - in fact, being the Mr Winterton of Polquenel! It's hard to know what Doris would be like without the continual presence of this domineering old woman in her house.

And then everyone keeps telling us how helpless, middle-aged and gentle Doris is - Joey in particular goes on about it so often that I find myself thinking that she clearly derives some particular glee from making it plain to everyone how much more of a 'young, fun' mother she is by comparison, with all her whirling about and tree-climbing.

But it never seems to me that marrying Commander Carey - a man who survived the episode that killed her own husband - was the action of a helpless nonentity. It must have taken some guts to break out of the atmosphere of hero-worship generated by Gran for her dead son, apart from anything else, and allow herself to love again, especially a man in bad health - and take on a teenage stepdaughter...?
Author:  MJKB [ Thu May 27, 2010 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Cosimo's Jackal wrote:
But it never seems to me that marrying Commander Carey - a man who survived the episode that killed her own husband - was the action of a helpless nonentity. It must have taken some guts to break out of the atmosphere of hero-worship generated by Gran for her dead son, apart from anything else, and allow herself to love again, especially a man in bad health - and take on a teenage stepdaughter...?


Personally, I think it must have been a great relief to her to be in the more dominant role. I'm not saying that Commander Carey is a bit of a wos, but he is in failing health when Doris marries him so it's likely that she became the carer in the relationship. I agree too about Joey's glee at being the 'fun mom' and Doris the clinging vine. And what a snide comment to pass about Doris being 'that nice woman, Mrs. Trelawney".
Author:  Fiona Mc [ Thu May 27, 2010 1:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Cosimo's Jackal wrote:
But it never seems to me that marrying Commander Carey - a man who survived the episode that killed her own husband - was the action of a helpless nonentity. It must have taken some guts to break out of the atmosphere of hero-worship generated by Gran for her dead son, apart from anything else, and allow herself to love again, especially a man in bad health - and take on a teenage stepdaughter...?


I actually think Doris and Gran must have been close and Gran must have been okay with Doris marrying again as she did continue to live with them after their marriage and didn't move out in a huff or anything. Yes Gran did hero worship her son, but so did Doris and both liked Roland Carey and what he had to say about their husband/son. I think Gran moved in not so much because Doris couldn't cope but simply because they were both lonely and it was company for Doris while her husband was away. Secondly its hard being a single parent and would have been nice to share that load, so I can see why Doris would be happy for Gran to move in. Her parents were dead (ML says so in Three). I could see Gran as being one of those people who like to be needed, kind of like Matey, and who would wither and die if they weren't. I also think she would have understood Doris's loneliness as she was a widow and would be happy for Doris to meet someone. If Doris had been 'busy' soon after she got married then she would have had her husband for 3 or the 11-12 years she was married. Gran was also the one to tell ML she has to be big enough to share her friends, so I could see her doing that with Roland Carey and Verity, even if it meant sharing her daughter-in-law who at the end of the day had been more like a daughter to her, than an in-law.
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Thu May 27, 2010 1:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
MJKB wrote:

I agree too about Joey's glee at being the 'fun mom' and Doris the clinging vine. And what a snide comment to pass about Doris being 'that nice woman, Mrs. Trelawney".


I do think this says something quite significant about Joey's fears! I think it's true that when we find ourselves repeating something hostile like that about someone else, to the point where it seems as if we have a bee in our bonnet - and the fact that the triplets say it in almost the same words as Joey suggests always suggests to me that they've heard their mother saying it - it suggests something about us, more than the person we're talking about. I know personally that elements of one of the people I dislike most in the world remind me of some of the parts of my own character I don't much care for.

For me, Joey's investment in continually characterising Doris as dull, middle-aged and gentle says something about her own fear of growing up, of being 'just' an ordinary mother, of being conventional, of no longer being the breezy eternal CS girl.

Not that she's not nice to Doris, also - inviting her to come and live at Freudesheim is very generous - but I think she's a kind of symbol for Joey.
Author:  Loryat [ Thu May 27, 2010 7:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I just discovered what looks like a first edition of this in a shop this weekend and it was in really bad condition so it was only £2! Naturally, I bought it. :wink:

I think I have a bit of a soft spot for this one because it was one of the ones I read as a kid, though funnily enough I didn't like it that much at the time because it was definitely very modern in comparison to the earlier books which were my favourites. (Also the librararies mainly carried the earliest twenty or so so I didn't have a clue who half the characters (including OOAOML) were).

I'd say this book is a strange mix of very strong points and very weak points. There are several blatant EBDisms (what was her editor thinking?) regarding particularly when the girls find out about going to school. Some of the storylines are also a bit feeble (though I do think that if over fifty books EBD wants to rehash a much earlier storyline she should be forgiven), mainly Roland Carey's death, which just isn't gone into enough to make it a valuable plotline.

On the other hand the characters are well drawn. Audrey and Solange both have distinct personalities, Val and Celia may be stock 'middles' but they are fairly convincing, especially in the way they keep secrets from Audrey, and Win is a very believable brat. I also like Mrs Everett and actually I'd say that most of the book dealing with the Everetts is good. (Does Mrs Everett teach at the CS later on? I can't remember but it seems as though EBD is hinting that she will). I'm sorry that we don't see more of Solange and Audrey later on.

When it comes to Doris Trelawney, I think she does lose a bit of character between Three Go and Wins the Trick. On the other hand she has had a lot to deal with and is physically weakening so I find this plausible.

Cosimo's Jackal wrote:
OK, the marriage was longer than I remembered, but even then - and despite the fact that Verity and Doris are clearly fond of one another -the fact that Verity is in a foreign country at boarding-school for most of that period wouldn't mean they got to know one another as well as if Verity lived permanently at home, so Verity's relationship with Doris could never even approximate Mary-Lou's.


Doesn't Verity live with the Trelawneys at some points even before the wedding though? Or is that Clem and Tony just? Actually with Mrs Trelawney being a very 'cuddly' sort of person I can see her taking on Verity's mothering even before she marries Commander Carey.

MJKB wrote:
Where on the way did Mrs. Trelawney, who in the early days seemed like an average type of mother, and Verity Carey, become so clingy and helpless? Generally speaking one of the strenghts of the CS series is that most of the characters are consistent over a very long period of time, but in Verity's case she changes from being a force to be reckoned as a very young child with into this weak, hopeless adult.


I'd say Mrs Trelawney always was a bit like that, but it is strange about Verity. To be fair to EBD, she does have the girls discuss that very point in Wins the Trick. Some of them suggest that Verity will make an effort if required, but that she's just used to having Mary-Lou doing things for her now. In fact I think someone points out that if Mary-Lou didn't do everything for Verity, she might stand on her own feet a bit more, which comes perilously close to criticising ML!

Considering that the triplets are encouraged not to rely on Len, and not to interfere in Len's case, it is pretty bad that the CS basically decided Verity couldn't possibly manage without ML and let such a dependent situation develop and persist.
Author:  MJKB [ Fri May 28, 2010 12:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Loryat wrote:
I'd say Mrs Trelawney always was a bit like that, but it is strange about Verity. To be fair to EBD, she does have the girls discuss that very point in Wins the Trick. Some of them suggest that Verity will make an effort if required, but that she's just used to having Mary-Lou doing things for her now. In fact I think someone points out that if Mary-Lou didn't do everything for Verity, she might stand on her own feet a bit more, which comes perilously close to criticising ML!


But why and how did a self assured little girl, whose besetting 'sin' was a streak of dogged obstinacy,and who could hold her own against the entire CS staff, turn into the clinging vine? It's never explained. Verity Ann goes home to her father's(?) after her first term at the CS, and returns the following term a shadow of her former self. Did she wander into Stepford, by mistake? As for Doris, she seems a perfectly ordinary mother in Three Goes, bossed about a bit by Granny T, admittedly, but she then becomes a sort of target for Joey's lavish patronage.
Author:  Alison H [ Fri May 28, 2010 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I assume that EBD turned Verity into a broken reed to make Mary-Lou seem even more capable and responsible, but the way it happens makes no sense. Even in the early Swiss books, we're told that Mary-Lou and Verity complement each other and are both strong characters in their own way, but then we see Mary-Lou making Verity's bed for her etc, and by Reunion everyone seems to see Verity as a big baby who needs either a stepsister or a husband to look after her.
Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Fri May 28, 2010 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Alison H wrote:
... by Reunion everyone seems to see Verity as a big baby who needs either a stepsister or a husband to look after her.


I know EBD's model of what a marriage is or should be differs massively from mine, but the idea that a husband naturally constitutes some kind of prospective nursemaid or minder for a clingy, helpless adult woman is a pretty strange one! I know EBD favours the masterful-looking-after style of husband in general, but one wonders whether any of the other characters ask themselves what on earth is supposed to be in it for Verity's prospective husband, other than being the useful way of getting her off Mary-Lou's hands and 'settled'?
Author:  MJKB [ Fri May 28, 2010 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
Alison H wrote:
I assume that EBD turned Verity into a broken reed to make Mary-Lou seem even more capable and responsible,


By the same token, then, Doris is used as a foil to make Joey appear brighter, breezier and funner.
Author:  claire [ Sat May 29, 2010 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
I think Mary-Lou (possibly and Gran) just took over and Verity-Anne just went along with it and took the easy ride - girl who doesn't want to make her bed in the morning, and step-sister willing to make it for her
Author:  MJKB [ Sat May 29, 2010 5:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Adult Matters: 'The Chalet School Wins the Trick'
We're often reminded that Mary-Lou and Verity balance each other out; Mary-Lou keeps Verity from mooning too much and Verity keeps a check on Mary-Lou's exuberance, but we never actually see the latter in action. A thought just occurred to me; Mary-Lou keeps her full name and remains consistent in her character, but Verity drops the Ann and looses her mojo.
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