The New Chalet School/A United Chalet School
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#1: The New Chalet School/A United Chalet School Author: Josie, Location: London PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:19 am

Syopnsis here:
http://www.newchaletclub.co.uk/ncc_library/synopses/synop_newcs_pb.htm
and here:
http://www.newchaletclub.co.uk/ncc_library/synopses/synop_unitedcs.htm

Am doing these two as one book, because they are really! So, how do you feel about the Saints joining the Chalet School? Does it make the school lose its cosy, friendly feel, or do you welcome the influx of new faces? Do any of the former 'Saints' stand out for you? What about the Mystic M? And the Middles having to perform their play as a punishment. And how about Ann's carelessness yet again - setting the hall on fire and nearly burning Joey's new book? Does EBD seem intent on portraying Ann as thoughtless? Other events include the thunderstorm when they get stuck on the coach and Gillian being announced as next head girl.

Please discuss away.....

 

#2:  Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:25 am

Well, let me see.

New was never one of my favourite Tyrol books, and it also seems to suffer in that it comes just before Exile which is so strong. It almost seems to be marking time between Jo leaving school and EBD deciding what to do with her next. I don't feel she handles the two schools merging idea as well as she does in later books (Bride and Feud), which must be about the only time where her first use of a plot isn't as strong as the repeats later in the series.

The school has already lost the cosiness / family atmos for me, long before New, but having a sudden influx of mainly unknown girls doesn't help and this book has, overall, less sense of cohesion to me than it should have - it seems rather bitty, even for EBD who specialises in the episodic format. Maybe the individual plotlines don't mesh as well as they do in some of the other books.

The only Saints who stand out this time around are Hilary, Nancy and Ida, who I love as a slightly cynical 'I can't believe we have to be new girls when we're so old but let's see how this goes' trio. At this point Betty and Elizabeth are just some more naughty kids, not really strong individuals.

The play as punishment is a neat idea, but I can't believe none of the staff asked why, to the point where years later Bill (or is it Hilda?) doesn't seem to know anything about it (can't remember the ref but Jo gives it all away much, much later). That's just bizarre.

And I hate the demonising of Anne for doing just the same kind of wacky stuff that is supposedly OK in pretty much any other character.

I like the idea that Hilary's potential Headgirl-ness is brought in at the end, becuase it makes the point that the two schools have grown together, but I don't feel EBD did a particularly good job of showing much tension between them in the first place, so as a climax this loses impact.

I like the coach-stuck-in-the-rain plot, though. And I like Hilda's awkwardness in taking over officially. And the seniors worrying about Mademoiselle. And lots of other little things. Honest.

 

#3:  Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 2:01 pm

The 'New' half of the 'New'/'United' split always struck me as being bland. I think I read it once or twice originally (I've a *feeling* it was one of the few books I didn't own originally) and I've only read that half of the story once since reaquiring it. 'United' by contrast, is one of my comfort reads. That second half has everything a good Chalet book has - naughty middles, a trip with excitements (out of all the trips-gone-wrong, the Saltzburg trip is probably my favourite from the whole series) and a grand wind up to the term in the end of term Garden Party (not entirely sure how a show being given in two different tents at the same time works, but as EBD doesn't show it, I'm guessing she didn't know either!).

In total, it's really not the strongest of the CS books. It's not as flat out silly as sections of CS and Jo (or is it Jo of...either way, book number 7 [you'd think I'd be able to get those titles straight by now!]); it's not as downright implausible or badly written as Princess or Redheads (the latter of which, I've ranted about before); it's just...well, frankly, it's boring!

Of the new characters, Nancy, Ida and Hilary are the three who really stand out (of course, they're also the three we get to spend the most time with), though Elizabeth and Betty are fairly well drawn, too. The rest of the Saints seem to be fairly colourless creatures who barely rate a mention! (See? Bland...)

I agree with Caroline that EBD does this basic storyline much, much better in Bride and Feud, though I beg to differ about the family nature of the school - I think this IS the book where the family feel goes. Jo Returns feels much, much more homey than this.

Ann... *shakes head* Ann is a walking health hazard. As she says, she nearly kills herself in New House and now she sets fire to the school. I feel sorry for her and for the demonising she gets, but on the other hand, one of the first things I ever got taught about ironing was never, EVER leave the iron switched on and unattended, no matter what.

The Mystic M was one of EBD's more enterprising shots at a plotline - but again, I think it was done better when she tried it again in Wins The Trick. As for the abduction of Sybil...well. First in a long line of Russell child abandonment - how on EARTH was a kiddie as young as Sybs was left alone for the length of time it took Maria and Marco to abduct her?!

Overall, it's very much a book of two halves, and unlike Lintons, this time the two halves do stand apart.

Ray *Smile*

 

#4:  Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:00 pm

What happened to the Mystic M afterwards? I seem to remember Melanie Kerdec being mentioned as a pupil in one of the Guernsey Chalet School books, but I can't recall the Balbinis being mentioned after they turned up at Wanda's house in United. Did Maria ever go to the Chalet School in the end?

 

#5:  Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:17 pm

She gets a mention in the fill-in written about the next term - beyond that, no. All you can assume is that she was one of the pupils forced to leave due to the Anschluss. Possibly EBD had something in mind for her and then real life events rather overtook EBD's plans?

Ray *speculating wildly*

 

#6:  Author: Mia, Location: London PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:23 pm

I know it's been said before, but the treatment of Maria and Mario when their mother dies is just so awful and upsetting. Even when I was younger I remember thinking that Joey and Jem were being a bit cruel and it's worse reading it now when I'm older. The way Jem breaks the news is terrible, he almost uses their mother's death as a punishment for the way they've behaved.... Crying or Very sad

 

#7:  Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:42 pm

Mia wrote:
I know it's been said before, but the treatment of Maria and Mario when their mother dies is just so awful and upsetting. Even when I was younger I remember thinking that Joey and Jem were being a bit cruel and it's worse reading it now when I'm older. The way Jem breaks the news is terrible, he almost uses their mother's death as a punishment for the way they've behaved.... Crying or Very sad


I've just reread this bit to answer this and I have to disagree, Mia - Jem is far, far, FAR more restrained than I would have been. Given that Maria and Mario kidnapped his daughter and then vanished, apparently into thin air, and then, once found, first admitted that they fully MEANT to hurt Jem and Madge by doing it (Maria says she's glad that Madge suffered over Sybil's whereabouts). At that point, Maria comes across as a nasty and unreconstructed brat, and had she said that to me, of my family, I'd have probably done much worse than Jem.

As for Joey, while she's cruel out of their hearing, when she's in it, she does treat them kindly - comforting Mario when Maria faints and then offering as much comfort to Maria afterwards.

Ray *pleasantly surprised to be able to defend the frequently indefensible!*

 

#8:  Author: Susan, Location: Carlisle PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:53 pm

I would love to read this book all in one either as a GGBP or a HB to see if it is any better than the 2 halves as I have them at the moment. I had New a lot longer than United and I never liked it. The behaviour of the Mystic M is just annoying, though I don't like Jem beating Mario or Jem and Jo's treatment of them when their mother died. I wonder if Rosa disliked looking after Sybil even then? She abandons her for ages in the garden - given the amount of childcare Madge and Jem had at this point why didn't she get someone else to sit with the children? Then later she leaves her alone near a boiling kettle!

I like United better. I love the coach trip and it was wonderful to read about it having seen it mentioned in other books. This is definitley the better part of the book, the only off putting bit is the Mario and Maria coincidence.

 

#9:  Author: Mia, Location: London PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:58 pm

Ooh Ray, I love a debate!!! Very Happy

I think my main problem with Jem (grr!) is this comment:

Jem wrote:
'It would be very cruel if I did such a thing,' agreed the doctor. 'Unfortunately, Maria, your foolish behaviour has brought its own punishment. Your mother asked for you repeatedly before she died, and she had to go with her last wish for you ungratified. You will always remember that. And the pity of it is that it need never have been.'


I just think this comment is unnecessary. Wouldn't Maria be thinking this for the rest of her life anyway without him having to articulate it? (Hmm though presumably EBD wanted to spell it out to her audience and get a few morals across).

I just feel that Jem should have separated the two issues, a) Princess Balbini's death and b) the issue of their behaviour (which I agree was awful) After all, he is supposed to be a doctor and presumably leave his personal feelings to the side a bit more?

Agree with you re Jo though - her reaction is just impulsive as usual I suppose! Smile


M x

 

#10:  Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 4:17 pm

*grin* I agree it's a harsh comment (and perhaps, EBD is going for the moral to her readers rather than staying in the story), but as I said, if it had been me, that would have been the nicest comment I could have managed under the circs.

Agreed, Jem probably SHOULD have tried to set his own feelings a bit more aside in dealing with Maria and Mario, but in not quite managing it, he shows he's human (something that Jem fails dismally with in later books).

Ray *likes debates too*

 

#11:  Author: aitchemelle, Location: West Sussex PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 4:36 pm

In agreement (ish) with Ray's comment about showing Jem as human, I would say one of the standing out bits of these books and the bit about the two M's is that we do get to see Jem's personality, rather than just Jem-the-doctor-Madge's-husband-opener-of-Fete's.... IMHO

I believe I have the HB transcript if anyone wanted it!?

 

#12:  Author: KB, Location: Melbourne, Australia PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:09 pm

Ray wrote:
She gets a mention in the fill-in written about the next term - beyond that, no. All you can assume is that she was one of the pupils forced to leave due to the Anschluss. Possibly EBD had something in mind for her and then real life events rather overtook EBD's plans?


Actually, you're not quite right, Ray. There is one further mention of her:

Quote:
Gwensi, these are Melanie Kerdec, who comes from Brittany; Nicole de Saumarez from Jersey; and Isabel Allan—she’s from Selkirk in Scotland.

(Goes To It)

As this is after the school moves to Wales, one can assume she stayed on and completed her schooling there, but EBD didn't want to draw attention to her again (or, more likely, completely forgot about her until a later reference to the kidnapping in Peggy).

And, to weigh in to the argument, my own feeling is that Jem said what needed to be said to the Balbinis in order for them to understand the full magnitude of their actions. I also feel that Jem was much more restrained than he might have been, considering his later fury against Sybil.

 

#13:  Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 5:03 am

I thought Ray was replying to the question about Maria Balbini - and as she was Italian it's unlikely that she'd have been a part of the Chalet School during the War years.

 

#14:  Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 7:31 am

I think, as Ray says, Maria Balbini must have left the school after the Anschluss because EBD doesn't mention her again, but she does feature briefly in Carol Allen's Gillian.

As for Melanie, after spotting that throw away mention in Goes To It I added her to the cast list of Robin - she's one of the disgruntled Third Formers who indulge in amateur dramatics at midnight because they haven't been given parts in the Nativity Play, along with Kathie Robertson and various other random minor characters of approx the same age. Don't think she appears anywhere else, though.

 

#15:  Author: KB, Location: Melbourne, Australia PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 12:52 pm

I think I've got Melanie in Peace, too, just as one of those single-mention characters.

 

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