The CBB :: View topic - Most irritating EBD-ism

through

#1: Most irritating EBD-ism Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:44 pm
—
What is the EBD-ism that irritates you the most?

I think the one that really, really annoys me is in Redheads (mind you, the last few books in the series are not at all to the standard of the earlier ones), where Copper Ansell is told that the staff, at any rate, must use her baptismal name of Flavia, since "nicknames have never been allowed".

Er, hello? Tom Gay? Robin Humphries?.....

#2: Author: dorian, Location: Dublin

Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2007 10:37 pm
—
The nickname used by Joey et al for...now, was it Herr Mensch or Herr Marani? Anyway, whichever of them it was, in the first few books he gets called "Onkel Riese" (Uncle Giant). Then it suddenly changes and he becomes for the entire rest of the series "Onkel Reise" (Uncle Journey). EBD appears not to have noticed that she muddled the spelling, and persists in perpetrating this absurdity (and mistranslating it as Uncle Giant, still), and it drives me absolutely batty.

#3: Author: Liane, Location: Manchester

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:55 am
—
I can't think of a particular one at the moment but the fluxuating ages of various people is really annoying!

#4: Author: Hannah-Lou, Location: Glasgow

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:02 pm
—
I know loads of different people change age lots of the time, but it's always really annoyed me that Natalie Mensch catches up age with Peggy Bettany. Maybe because we see them as babies and there's obviously around 3 years between them. Also, within the space of one book the gap between Mary-Lou and Clem grows, and that annoys me too. And I have a sneaking suspicion that Amy Stevens is past 20 before she leaves school. I don't care how delicate she was, that's just ridiculous! Laughing

#5: Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:55 pm
—
Corney Flower must have been well over 20, too, I always think!

#6: Author: Catriona, Location: South Yorkshire

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 7:45 pm
—
I think the one that annoys me most (although I may yet think of others!) is Bruno starting off as a doctor but ending up working in a bank. Was he perhaps not good enough to work at the San and so had to change careers?

#7: Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:43 pm
—

Catriona wrote:

I think the one that annoys me most (although I may yet think of others!) is Bruno starting off as a doctor but ending up working in a bank. Was he perhaps not good enough to work at the San and so had to change careers?

Sadly, although it is an EBDism, there's several all too likely reasons why he might have had a change of career. It isn't much of a stretch to suggest the Nazis injured him in some way that returning to being a doctor was out of the question.

I think, for me, the most annoying EBDisms relate to head girls. In Highland Twins Mary Shand (Shaw?) is Head Girl and Elizabeth Arnett is random-prefect-from-left (she probably had a proper role but I can't remember it and I don't have HT to hand!) yet, in Lavender and Gay, Elizabeth's the Head Girl and Mary's been reduced to library prefect! Even more odd is the strange fate of Ros Lilley who was last seen, as Head Girl, in Redheads and then never seen or mentioned again (Len taking over the Head Girl's role in Adrienne).

Having said that, Kitty Burnett's school career rates a pretty close second. You can explain Amy Stevens' extended schooling; if you squint, you can explain Corney's. There's no explanation for Kitty!

Ray *tossing in small change before returning to her editting*

#8: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:44 pm
—
The name changes annoy me the most. I appreciate that EBD didn't have a computer database or anything, but it still grates on me the way surnames and sometimes even first names change!

The changes in age are annoying too, especially Sybil's. I can kind of understand forgetting where you were up to with minor characters, but not with one of the Russells.

Oh well!

#9: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:06 pm
—
There's Prunella Davidson, a major character in one book, who becomes Prunella Davies in a later one.

The name changes are annoying because way back in Jo Returns EBD has Jo muddling two of her characters and sitting down to make a list to prevent it happening again. She clearly didn't follow her own advice.

#10: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:41 am
—
Don't forget Louise Redfield/Redmond, Cyrilla Mazirus/Maurus, Rosalie Browne/Way, Ghislaine Thome/St Amant, Lisa/Louise Grunbaum, Jean Morris/Morrison, and our old friends Gwensi Tudor, Betty Burnett, Andree Lecoutier and Biddy O'Hara.

The group of girls who start out in form with Mary-Lou and the Gang, and end up with the triplets, three years younger. Heather Clayton, the Dawbarns, Primrose Treovase, Emerence Hope, Betty Landon, Jo Scott and Francie Wilford all drift down, spending two or three years in Upper IV, and then a year in Inter V. Jo Scott is there until the end of Va and then vanishes completely, while poor Prudence starts out in form with Mary-Lou and ends up two forms *below* the triplets.

There are also girls who are in form with the triplets when the school moves to Switzerland (and therefore at least a year and a half older than them), and end up three or four years below them - Connie Winter and Isabel Drew, for example.

David Russell ending up older than the school.

Judy Willoughby being born *before* the triplets, but ending up three years younger than them.

#11: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:54 am
—
It may be considered delightful dottiness on EBD's part, but really it is laziness. I sometimes wonder if she wrote more than one draft or even read over her work before she handed an MS to her publisher. I read in 'Behind the Chalet School' that she was always late for deadlines and that her MS was often crumpled and with coffee rings (milky of course!) The most glaring error for me was the one in Carola Storms when Carola doesn't recognise Joey's house in spite of having visited before. Also when Daisy comments that Carola is the girl who 'ran away to school' her companion Jean doesn't bat an eyelid, even thogh it has been kept a dark secret.

#12: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:02 pm
—
This isn't really an EBDism in one way, but it is in another.

Marilyn Evans, who as we know put her own work before the School when she was Head girl, was severely criticised for that. But what I want to know is this: What did Miss Annersley think that Marilyn's parents were paying hefty fees for? I'm sure they weren't paying them so their daughter could flunk university entrance and have to accept second best in her future career. After all, being a former head girl of the CS isn't exactly a qualification for a decent salary, is it?

#13: Author: Ruth B, Location: Oxford, UK

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:24 pm
—
My favourite is in the CS and Jo: At the beginning of the book, Joey ask's Mademoiselle if Miss Browne had relented and allowed the Saints to have boats. ML answers in the negative. However, by the end of the book the Saints are experienced and accomplished oarswomen capable of racing the Chaletians!

Also, in Exploits of the CS girls, Frieda arrives on the Sonnalpe for half term twice! I can understand inconsistencies between books, but this is in the space of a page or two!!

#14: Author: Carys, Location: London

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:31 pm
—
Is it in Two Sams where one form has two or is it three different form prefects in the space of two or three pages?

The varying of characters ages really annoy me to!

#15: Author: Gabrielle, Location: Near Paris, France

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:41 pm
—
The varying ages of characters gets to me too.

But honestly the teensy tiny nitpick I have is in New Mistress when it is mentioned that Miss O'Ryan and Miss Ferras took a taxi across Paris from the Gare du Nord to the Gare de l'Est. They are right next door to each other. It takes barely ten minutes to walk between them. It would make as much sense as saying that someone took a taxi across London to get from Euston to King's Cross.

The train stations haven't moved since she saw them, which is why it irritates me so much. She had been to both train stations, she knew where they were.

#16: Author: arky72, Location: Cheshire

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:53 pm
—
I am just reading Exile, and Joey recognises Mrs. Lucy walking up the path.

One paragraph later we discover Joey has never met her before.

So how did she know who it was walking up the path??

#17: Author: Mia, Location: London

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 10:07 pm
—

Mel wrote:

It may be considered delightful dottiness on EBD's part, but really it is laziness. I sometimes wonder if she wrote more than one draft or even read over her work before she handed an MS to her publisher. I read in 'Behind the Chalet School' that she was always late for deadlines and that her MS was often crumpled and with coffee rings (milky of course!)

Oh but this is why I love her! Laughing

#18: Author: tiffinata, Location: melbourne, australia

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:17 am
—
They can be so handy for people to write fill-ins to explain what happened!

#19: Author: Gabrielle, Location: Near Paris, France

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:25 pm
—
It isn't an EBDism but her French drives me nutty. Talk about a French man tearing his hair out. I get frustrated by how she just drops it into books as though it was correct.

If anyone cares the vast majority of the French in Redheads is not correct and has never been spoken by a French person.

#20: Author: Alex, Location: Oxford

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:32 pm
—
I am always really irritated by the way that Maeve starts out older than Josette and then seems to end up younger (although obviously Josette is a prodigy).

ETA Also I really get cross when Kitty Burnett (I think it's in Exile or at War) remembers that Simone was 2nd prefect. No she wasn't, that was Frieda!

#21: Author: Squirrel, Location: St-Andrews or Dunfermline

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 1:22 pm
—
I agree about the Simone-being-second-prefect thing. The other thing that gets to me is Matey changing from being Lloyd to almost all of the others during the course of the series - though I think that was partly confusion when I was younger.

#22: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:49 pm
—
I can forgive EBD almost everything. It's so incredibly hard to be consistent, even within one book and with a good editor and writing on a PC, that I'm amazed she even managed as well as she did, writing 58+ books in long hand, over the space of 40 odd years, with pretty much no editing or record keeping.

However, changing Mademoiselle's name from Elise to Therese after about two books, when the cast list stretches to only about 30 characters, is a bit forgetful even for me to overlook.

Very Happy

#23: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:06 pm
—
Then there's poor Josette

Her name changes from Josephine Margaret to Josephine Mary.

Her birthday is given as various August, September, October, November *and* December. In Three Go she's 8, 9 and 10 in the space of a few chapters.

She starts out about 1 year, give or take a few months, older than the triplets. At school she's at least three years older than them, and two forms ahead. A big deal is made about how old the triplets are for their age, and how brilliant they are in form, but Josette is even more advanced than they are for her age.

---

Then there's the time where ML and a few others get promoted in form at the end of the fall term in Three Go, and the next book all their former classmates have been bumped up too. The same thing happens with Bride and her friends in Lavender and later books.

#24: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:03 am
—
Not that it's strictly an EBDism but I've never understood why the Robin speaks French as a first language. She doesn't have French parents and she grew up in Germany.

#25: Author: Tan, Location: London via Newcastle Australia

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 2:57 pm
—
There are a few ... I have just reread Barbara, and it appears that Miss Annersley had never met Barbara. I find this hard to fathom as the school was on Guernsey for some time, and as well, the Guernsey families relocated to Wales near the school.

Matron doesn't know the medical history of Barbara, and I again I find this puzzling.

I have also just reread Challenge - how can Con be the 25th editor of the Chaletian? Joey was editor for several years, as was Stacey ...

#26: Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:21 pm
—

Lexi wrote:

Not that it's strictly an EBDism but I've never understood why the Robin speaks French as a first language. She doesn't have French parents and she grew up in Germany.

I think EBD was slightly muddling Polish and Russian here - Robin's mother was Polish, and EBD assumed that, like an upper-class Russian woman of the time, she would have spoken French. Not sure whether she would or not - Poland, as a nation-state, didn't exist for about 200 years prior to 1918, but obviously Polish nationalism was very strong, and I imagine keeping the language going would have been part of that.

But Ted Humphries was English.... and Robin goes from being rather delicate and speaking mostly French to being pretty much as healthy as anybody else and speaking totally English within ten months (the "gap" in Exile).

#27: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 4:26 pm
—
And Robin isn't delicate when she first appears - suddenly, a book later, she's a 'frail little mortal'. Then she is the school baby for at least two years. She's referred to as 'the baby' and is wearing pinafores, sleeping in cots, being carried around and basically being treated as if she were about five years old, until she's eleven - almost as old as Joey was at the beginning of the series.

It's continually stressed how frail she is, that they're worried she is going to inherit TB from her mother, and that she needs to be kept at the Annexe and high altitudes until she hits adulthood if they hope to save her. Then she gets sent to India for six months - the same place that's so unhealthy for white children that they get sent back to boarding school in England.

I have to laugh in Goes to It, when Miss Annersley comments that Robin has always been old for her years, given how long she was treated like a small child.

#28: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 4:51 pm
—
Oh and unless my paperback is missing something that was in the original or I've gone a bit mad, when Jem first appears, he isn't a doctor. He just introduces himself in Bond style as "Russell, James Russell."

Again, not really an EBDism, just something I find a bit odd. She probably just changed her mind about him before writing the second book though.

#29: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:10 pm
—

Lexi wrote:

Not that it's strictly an EBDism but I've never understood why the Robin speaks French as a first language. She doesn't have French parents and she grew up in Germany.

I always supposed French was the language her parents spoke to each other, as he was unlikely to know Polish and she presumably didn't know English. But since she would have learned English from her English father, I don't know why she spoke English with a French accent.

She should have known Polish too, but we never hear about that.

#30: Author: Dreaming Marianne, Location: The West Country. Oo-arr.

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:12 pm
—
What language does she sing "ze Red Sarafan" in - isn't it Russian?

Oooh, yes that's my most irritating EBDism - ickle wickle lisps on behalf of aaaaallll the children.

#31: Author: Gabrielle, Location: Near Paris, France

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:08 pm
—
I think she sings it in Russian but there are also German versions of it too so it is possible she sings it in German. That would just confuse matters more really wouldn't it?

#32: Author: dorian, Location: Dublin

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:09 pm
—

Dreaming Marianne wrote:

Oooh, yes that's my most irritating EBDism - ickle wickle lisps on behalf of aaaaallll the children.

That isn't really an EBD-ism - just a severe annoyance!

#33: Author: KB, Location: Melbourne, Australia

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:11 pm
—

Dreaming Marianne wrote:

Oooh, yes that's my most irritating EBDism - ickle wickle lisps on behalf of aaaaallll the children.

Absolutely, and it's one thing that horrified me in Priya's India - that at one point (very early on, and I'd guess it was missed during the editing process) she still has Robin lisping at the age of 13!

Last edited by KB on Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:52 am; edited 1 time in total

#34: Author: Cath V-P, Location: Newcastle NSW

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:00 am
—
I can't give an explanation as to why Robin's first language is French, but I was suddenly reminded of a post-doc friend of ours and his wife from about sixteen years ago. Daya was Indian (first language Tamil), Anya Polish, and they spoke French as their common language to their toddler daughter and each other.

#35: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:53 pm
—

jennifer wrote:

And Robin isn't delicate when she first appears - suddenly, a book later, she's a 'frail little mortal'. Then she is the school baby for at least two years. She's referred to as 'the baby' and is wearing pinafores, sleeping in cots, being carried around and basically being treated as if she were about five years old, until she's eleven - almost as old as Joey was at the beginning of the series.

In fairness to EBD, Frieda is wearing a pinafore in School At and Frau Mensch gets Joey to wear one too. So maybe it's a continental/period thing that we can't really relate to?

As regards Robin speaking French I always understood it in the way Cath explained it. Maybe Captain Humphries kept talking French to Robin cos it was what they were both used to?

My least favourite EBDism (that I can remember at the moment) is Suzanne and Yvette Mercier randomly switching round in Exile.

Edit: and also Amy Stevens saying that she has 'always' wanted to be a teacher. I know she wasn't necessarily going always want to be a poet, but it would be nice if she remembered that she had wanted to be one. Rolling Eyes

#36: Author: Caroline58, Location: St Albans

Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:44 pm
—
I'm always upset on her behalf that Berta Hamel isn't invited to the Reunion, although Sophie is, even though they started school at the same time.

#37: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:25 pm
—

Caroline58 wrote:

I'm always upset on her behalf that Berta Hamel isn't invited to the Reunion, although Sophie is, even though they started school at the same time.

Never mind the ohter Hamel sister who appears and disappears in the first few books...can't remember her name but think she was named in Exploits, and went to the Annexe.

#38: Author: Fatima, Location: Sunny Qatar

Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 4:53 pm
—
According to the A-Z there were two other sisters - Gretel (mentioned in Head Girl and Exploits) and Amalie (mentioned in Lintons).

#39: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:57 pm
—
It's worse than I thought...

ETA Think my least favourite EBD-ism (and general literary technique) is when she goes 'if she had known how important...was to be to her in the future, she would have looked/listened with even greater interest/attention'. I know it's supposed to whet our appetites but she does it so often it's really annoying. And it makes the stories so predictable!

#40: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:33 pm
—
Especially as, on some occasions that she does that, she doesn't follow it up! Rolling Eyes

#41: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:10 am
—
Another one:

Gottfried Mensch is supposed to be coming back to Austria after his father's death, to be near his mother. He is also supposed to come to the San. He never comes there and Herr Mensch is alive in later books.

Frau Mieders' mother reappears from the dead, too.

#42: Author: Pado, Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:10 am
—
What gets me is when she clearly has taken a break and then failed to read her previous few pages when she returns...like in School at where at one point Grizel is told to stay home from a walk because she's not feeling well and on the very next page there she is, promenading around the lake with the rest of them.

Or in (I think) Exploits, where we are told there are 8 prefects, and two paragraphs later there are 9. But only 8 are given prep. And then the 9th is given music duty.

As a child I used to assume that there was something wrong with my reading comprehension skills when I ran across these things.

#43: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 12:52 pm
—
I wonder how many bags of mail she used to recieve pointing out these errors? They certainly never appeared in the newsletters!

#44: Author: Ruth B, Location: Oxford, UK

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 1:16 pm
—

Mel wrote:

I wonder how many bags of mail she used to recieve pointing out these errors? They certainly never appeared in the newsletters!

I wonder if she did? Most of these things I've only noticed as an adult rereading the books. As a child, they completely passed me by!

Edit: Hooray! After nearly 3 years I've got over 1000 posts.

#45: Author: Fatima, Location: Sunny Qatar

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:36 pm
—
I missed them all as a child, too; in fact, as an adult I only notice them if someone has already pointed them out.

#46: Author: Clare, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:11 pm
—

Ruth B wrote:

I wonder if she did? Most of these things I've only noticed as an adult rereading the books. As a child, they completely passed me by!

Edit: Hooray! After nearly 3 years I've got over 1000 posts.

Congrats on your posting tally! I nearly had 1000 once... I had 999 posts and was about to post my 1000th when the old board died!

Back on topic Embarassed

I did notice a few things as a child, but not much. The age changes have always irritated me. One thing I noticed was the change in the Triplet's birthday. Originally it's the 3rd of November and then it changed to the 5th so they could be Joey's "big bang".

#47: Author: Lottie, Location: Humphrey's Corner

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:21 pm
—
The bit which always annoys me is in Camp.

Quote:

There were three charabancs. ... The packs were all piled into the last, since it had only ten girls and one mistress, while the others had twelve persons each.

I always assumed that EBD's dislike of maths was as great as Joey's, but surely even she could have worked out that the third charabanc had eleven people on board. Were the packs really so small that thirty-five of them (assuming one per person) would fit into the space occupied by one passenger?

#48: Author: Dawn, Location: Leeds, West Yorks

Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:30 pm
—

Lottie wrote:

The bit which always annoys me is in Camp.

Quote:

There were three charabancs. ... The packs were all piled into the last, since it had only ten girls and one mistress, while the others had twelve persons each.

That was one of the very few I noticed as a child - another was Carola and Jean wondering who's house it was when Carola had already been there. Most of the others I didn't spot until I came on here and had them brought to my attention Embarassed

#49: Author: Lolly, Location: Back in London

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:37 pm
—
What is the matter with me? I never notice any of these things

#50: Author: Mia, Location: London

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:59 pm
—

Lolly wrote:

What is the matter with me? I never notice any of these things

*rofl* me neither, not before I came on here, I must be the least observant person alive!

#51: Author: Liane, Location: Manchester

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:18 pm
—
I don't notice them either, then when someone on here points them out they seem so obvious! Embarassed

#52: Author: asgaard, Location: Scotland

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:48 pm
—

Lolly wrote:

What is the matter with me? I never notice any of these things

Me either lolol

Heather

#53: Author: Mia, Location: London

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:51 pm
—
Ah, I think there are quite a few bits in the Newsletters where she replies to readers' queries - they just don't print the question. Some of them are her explaining her plot dodges, bless! One example - Robin read Modern Languages first and Social Sciences after. *g*

Oh and may I quote what I've just found in the Newsletters re Bruno von Ahlen cos I think someone mentioned it above?

Quote:

After the war Bruno von Ahlen had to take what work he could obtain and this was the best choice

I have just realised that I frequently bleat on about the Newsletters like a woman obsessed but they are fab. Everyone should own them. I often wonder if any of the people who wrote in are still interested in the CS or on here, etc.

#54: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:40 pm
—
I've just found one that's new to me - always fun!

Quote:

From Tom Tackles:
"She and Dr Jack are guardians to the McLeod girls as long as they are school age"

It's in the paperback as well. Did no-one on the editorial side ever think to check for these things before the books were re-released? It's not as if the twins are minor characters either, they've just had a whole book written about them.

#55: Author: Róisín, Location: Ireland

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:31 am
—
Mia I'm with you re the Newsletters. Everyone should own a copy! I like it when girls wrote in and asked her how they could become writers too. And she told them to practise by going and reading Dickens and Austen etc. Very Happy

#56: Author: Rosie, Location: Land of Three-Quarters Sky

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:35 am
—
Gah. Now you have made me want to re-read my copy. And I know exactly where it is - on my bookshelf in England!

#57: Author: Fatima, Location: Sunny Qatar

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:07 pm
—
Yep, I was similarly inspired, and that's where mine is, too - although not on your shelf, Rosie, but my mother's!

#58: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:41 pm
—

Lexi wrote:

I've just found one that's new to me - always fun!

Quote:

From Tom Tackles:
"She and Dr Jack are guardians to the McLeod girls as long as they are school age"

And Biddy O'Ryan gets called Biddy O'Hara through all of Highland Twins.

#59: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 9:38 am
—

jennifer wrote:

And Biddy O'Ryan gets called Biddy O'Hara through all of Highland Twins.

Maybe in some sort of EBD-istic twist she'll find she's related to Scarlett Laughing

#60: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:02 am
—

LizB wrote:

jennifer wrote:

And Biddy O'Ryan gets called Biddy O'Hara through all of Highland Twins.

Maybe in some sort of EBD-istic twist she'll find she's related to Scarlett Laughing

Now that would make a lovely drabble ...

And Juliet's husband really is called O'Hara, so he might be related to Scarlett even if Biddy isn't.

*Suppresses Gone With The Wind bunnies firmly.*

#61: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:33 pm
—

LizB wrote:

jennifer wrote:

And Biddy O'Ryan gets called Biddy O'Hara through all of Highland Twins.

Maybe in some sort of EBD-istic twist she'll find she's related to Scarlett Laughing

Maybe that's why they weren't allowed to read it in Wrong!

#62: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 2:19 pm
—
And as for the charabancs in 'Camp'. Near the beginning of the book, they are to travel in two charabancs. On the day itself, they have three, and it's obviously all been organised before.

#63: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:12 pm
—
While I think some of the EBDisms are shocking (didn't the woman ever read anything over?) IMO it's more shocking that these were allowed to stay in. Wasn't there some sort of editor to notice mistakes like this? If not the tiny details, at least the glaringly obvious ones. (Though when you think about it, whoever was responsible for the abridgements clearly wasn't making much effort and that was years later, so maybe it's too much to expect).

#64: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:46 pm
—
I suspect that professional editors and proof readers didn't really feature much in EBD's writing experience, or that of other girls authors of her generation. When she shows examples of Joey writing, she has Jo proof reading her own work (those long, fascinating galley proofs in Exile spring to mind), and no mention of editing at all. EJO does the same thing with Mary-Dorothy Devine in the Abbey books - Mary has various of her young friends read her stories looking for errors, usually when they are stuck in an invalid chair due to the misbehaviour of the terrible twins.... Rolling Eyes

So, I suspect EBD did it all herself, more or less. Although I expect her books were typed for her, and type set. And then she got to proof them herself. When you think about it like that, it's remarkable she's as consitent as she is...!

#65: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 5:19 pm
—
The Georgette Heyer mailing list I am on recently discussed what would be involved in sorting out a mistake in a manuscript.

Unlike today, there were no computers, so it wasn't easy to shunt paragraphs around, or do a find and replace for Lepattre with Lapattre (for example). In a typewritten manuscript if there was a mistake, the whole page would have to be retyped. If this affected the flow of text onto the next page, then all pages to the end of the chapter would have to be retyped. As the manuscript pages would be numbered, if the change affected the page numbering, then the whole work would have to be retyped right through to the end. Because of this an author may have let minor mistakes they noticed go, as it would be too timeconsuming to retype the whole lot - remembering that time spent retyping was time that could be spent starting on the next manuscript, and that was what brought in the money.

So it is possible that EBD did know about some of the EBDisms, but decided to let them go.

#66: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 9:11 am
—
So, if, say, an author wrote a book longhand, and then had it typed for submission to their publishers (like Joey does), the pressure would really be on not to make any further changes at that point? Or only major changes that were requested by the publishers, not the little fiddly, tinkering changes that most of us delight in making these days in an electronic document.

So, I'm guessing that the majority of EBD's self-editing would have been done in her original hand-written manuscript, which would probably end up full of crossings out and rewritings, and be quite hard to read. She might then write out a "fair copy" for the typist to work from, perhaps. Or perhaps like Joey, type it herself, editing as she went. I can imagine that would make it really difficult to check back and forth for consistency of minor facts. She would basically have to have the whole story clear in her head, but the colour of someone's eyes or which dormy they are in in Ch1, might not have been so memorable or very easy for her to check once she got to Ch16...

Thank goodness for Find and Replace, that's what I say.

#67: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:33 am
—

LizB wrote:

The Georgette Heyer mailing list I am on recently discussed what would be involved in sorting out a mistake in a manuscript.

Oooh Liz, can I have a link to this mailing list please?

#68: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:48 pm
—
You can and may Very Happy

I have PM'd you.

#69: Author: Joan the Dwarf, Location: Er, where am I?

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:12 pm
—
The EBDism does have a long and illustrious history, and includes Shakespeare! If you go into all of his EBDisms then you can end up going rather mad... My fav. one from A-level was a character who knew everything necessary to resolve a tragic situation and just decided to say nothing. No reasons given, it not even noticed that she can clear it all up! But then, of course, if she had there wouldn't be a plot Cool

#70: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:57 pm
—
I found a Wodehouse-ism the other day... one of Bertie's fiancées is an only child in one book and acquires a sister in another. Smile

#71: Author: Ruth B, Location: Oxford, UK

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:51 pm
—

Kate wrote:

I found a Wodehouse-ism the other day... one of Bertie's fiancées is an only child in one book and acquires a sister in another. Smile

#72: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:11 pm
—
*nods* I found a Wodehouseism only when I copied it in writing a spoof Jeeves and Wooster using two different books as source material. I didn't notice til a reader pointed it out to me Embarassed

#73: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:33 pm
—
An EBDism that really annoyed me is Margot struggling with her French GCSE exam. No CS girl should struggle with any languages exam given they speak those languages half the time, and especially not Margot who has been educated in French Canada (EBD having ignored the linguistic differences between French and Canadian French). I know we always have to be told that Margot doesn't work hard enough and is always paying the price, but EBD should really have picked a different exam.

#74: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:44 pm
—
I suppose Margot might have a good accent and vocabulary but lack the detailed knowledge of grammar she'd need for a written exam. That would fit in with EBD's assertion that Margot was often set back in her studies because she had been careless about her work earlier in her school career and so found she was lacking essential knowledge.

#75: Author: Lottie, Location: Humphrey's Corner

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:47 pm
—

JayB wrote:

I suppose Margot might have a good accent and vocabulary but lack the detailed knowledge of grammar she'd need for a written exam. That would fit in with EBD's assertion that Margot was often set back in her studies because she had been careless about her work earlier in her school career and so found she was lacking essential knowledge.

And since we're talking about O-Levels in the 1950s, not today's GCSEs, it would have been quite easy to fail, if the grammar was a bit sketchy - I think you lost a mark for every error, even if it was the same one again, so it was quite easy to get down to zero!

#76: Author: Dawn, Location: Leeds, West Yorks

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:57 pm
—

Caroline wrote:

So, I'm guessing that the majority of EBD's self-editing would have been done in her original hand-written manuscript, which would probably end up full of crossings out and rewritings, and be quite hard to read. She might then write out a "fair copy" for the typist to work from, perhaps. Or perhaps like Joey, type it herself, editing as she went. I can imagine that would make it really difficult to check back and forth for consistency of minor facts. She would basically have to have the whole story clear in her head, but the colour of someone's eyes or which dormy they are in in Ch1, might not have been so memorable or very easy for her to check once she got to Ch16...

Thank goodness for Find and Replace, that's what I say.

She says somewhere that she types directly as she writes (Newsletters??), so it would be incredibly hard for her to change things after she's typed them down.

There is also a lovely quote from her in the first newsletter

Quote:

A friend of mine, the father of a grown-up girl, still reads the books - and he knows them so thoroughly, that if I make any slips in references to past stories, he corrects them without any hesitation. I wonder how many of you could do as much?

#77: Author: macyrose, Location: Great White North (Canada)

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:24 pm
—
In answer to EBD's question from the newsletter:

Quote:

that if I make any slips in references to past stories, he corrects them without any hesitation. I wonder how many of you could do as much?

Definitely a lot of us here could! Laughing

#78: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 7:02 pm
—
I've actually corrected things in the book that are truely glaring errors as it annoys me so much to keep re-reading them.

#79: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:09 pm
—

JayB wrote:

That would be understandable if the girls just spoke the languages but they are expected to do written coursework in those languages too - I don't think anyone as smart as Margot could be struggling with an O Level (my bad) exam after having spent most of her life being educated trilingually and actually receiving over a years education solely in French as a young girl. If it's that hard for Chaletians, how did anyone else ever manage to pass? (In EBD's eyes anyway).

#80: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:42 pm
—
Would there have been novels and poetry on the O Level course? No matter how good Margot's French would have been, if she hadn't read the books, she couldn't have done much with such an exam.

#81: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:19 pm
—
No it would have been translation, comprehension and a basic essay/story to write. I did mine in 1963 so it would be about right. EBD wouldn't have known though. It was a gaffe on her part to choose French for Margot to find difficult.

#82: Author: Tara, Location: Malvern, Worcestershire

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:21 pm
—
There wasn't any lit. at O Level, just English/French, French/English translation, a short oral exam - and a dictee, IIRC. Might have forgotten something (it's a very long time ago!), but lit. didn't start until A Level.

#83: Author: Jane, Location: Southampton

Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 2:33 pm
—
I've just found a new one I've never noticed or seen mentioned before. In 'Lavender', one one page Mollie McNab is explicitly named as 'an ornament of Lower Third' or whatever, and then on the next page she's in Lower Fourth so that Bride will have to sheepdog Lavender. Mollie Carew remains in Lower Third as form prefect. (And Matron Gould sorts out the dresses!)

#84: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:45 pm
—

Jane wrote:

(And Matron Gould sorts out the dresses!)

I'm reading Mary-Lou, for the first time, where they have the sheet-sand-pillowcases party after Sybil tells them about the ones in Tyrol. They go and ask Matey if she's THAT Matey or a different one, and I was fully expecting her to reply "all Maties are as one" or possibly "I can't possibly tell you as the author doesn't know".

#85: Author: Liz K, Location: Bedfordshire

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:01 am
—

Squirrel wrote:

The other thing that gets to me is Matey changing from being Lloyd to almost all of the others during the course of the series - though I think that was partly confusion when I was younger.

This is the one that niggles me, along with Mademoiselle's name changes - There/Elise - La Pattre/Lapattre/Le Pattre/Lepattre -whatever!

#86: Author: Liz K, Location: Bedfordshire

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:02 am
—
Oops, meant Therese, not There!!
Embarassed

#87: Author: Liz K, Location: Bedfordshire

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:13 am
—

jennifer wrote:

And Biddy O'Ryan gets called Biddy O'Hara through all of Highland Twins.

Never noticed that!

#88: Author: JenniferG, Location: Durham

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:23 am
—
I'm doing a read-through of the La Rochelle series, and I get confused by Rosamond Atherton/Willoughby's child. At the end of "Janie of La Rochelle" she has a little boy named Harold Nigel, which gets immediately shortened to 'Hal'. Six years later, at the beginning of "Janie Steps In", his nickname has inexplicably become Toby.

I've never found any explanation for this, has anyone else? I don't know if she just made up an entirely new name and hoped no-one would notice, but knowing that she was writing about a character who already had a name it seems an odd thing not to check up on..

-Jennifer

#89: Author: macyrose, Location: Great White North (Canada)

Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:18 am
—
Facetious answer: maybe Hal died as an infant, Rosamund was already pregnant again and the next child was called Toby. Wink

Real answer: EBD wasn't known for her consistency in names (among other things). Another child who changes names between books is Simone's second daughter who's Anne-Claire in one book and Marie-Roseline in another. And I think Mlle Lepattre had her fist name changed from Therese to Elise (or vice versa) and she was a much more major character in the books than Hal/Toby or Simone's daughter.

#90: Author: JenniferG, Location: Durham

Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:57 pm
—

macyrose wrote:

Facetious answer: maybe Hal died as an infant, Rosamund was already pregnant again and the next child was called Toby. Wink

Heh.

I did wonder that, but he's still described as about the same age as Julie. Rosamund would have had to get pregnant almost immediately.. (which some of them almost seem to, to be fair. Wasn't there someone in the Chalet universe who gave birth on New Year's Day and Christmas Day of the same year?)

I know it's almost certainly an EBD-ism, but I prefer the idea that Toby is just a completely random nickname that he was given as a baby which never gets explained. I mean, his little sister is Blossom - is that *really* her full name? It seems oddly flowery for the very sensible Rosamund to choose, especially given how much she disliked the Blossom (real name Adelicia) with whom she went to school..

-Jennifer

#91: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:22 pm
—

JenniferG wrote:

I mean, his little sister is Blossom - is that *really* her full name? It seems oddly flowery for the very sensible Rosamund to choose, especially given how much she disliked the Blossom (real name Adelicia) with whom she went to school..

I think EBD just liked the name Blossom. Chalet girls are meant not to have nicknames (unless they're Robin or Tom) so I'd assume she's really Blossom - do we ever see the staff calling her that?

#92: Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 8:31 pm
—

JenniferG wrote:

I know it's almost certainly an EBD-ism, but I prefer the idea that Toby is just a completely random nickname that he was given as a baby which never gets explained.

I used to know a Toby who was always called it, but it was not, in fact, the name on his birth certificate - his parents wanted to call their son Toby, but thought he might absolutely hate it, so it wasn't an official name. In fact, he actually did rather like it, and was, apparently confirmed it, even though he wasn't baptised it!

#93: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:59 am
—
I read a Georgette Heyer yesterday in which a character was twice described as having 'pansy-brown eyes'. Do you even get brown pansies??? It must have been a common expression back in the day.

Just thought I'd share that with you all!

#94: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:42 pm
—
Brown pansies are lovely - a kind of toffee colour!

#95: Author: Bee, Location: Canberra, Australia

Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 2:35 am
—
I get so sick of reading about how, by the end of a mistress or prefect talking to them, the girls were "weeping copiously - except for so-and-so, who had an almost boyish hatred of tears" after they misbehaved. It always struck me as odd that girls of twelve or fourteen would cry in front of the authorities like that!

It also makes me wonder why the prefects (particularly when Joey was Head Girl, as this happened frequently) were allowed to talk to the girls so severely that they would all leave in tears. Surely that's bullying?

#96: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 4:07 am
—

Bee wrote:

I get so sick of reading about how, by the end of a mistress or prefect talking to them, the girls were "weeping copiously - except for so-and-so, who had an almost boyish hatred of tears" after they misbehaved. It always struck me as odd that girls of twelve or fourteen would cry in front of the authorities like that!

It also makes me wonder why the prefects (particularly when Joey was Head Girl, as this happened frequently) were allowed to talk to the girls so severely that they would all leave in tears. Surely that's bullying?

That's always bugged me too. They're encouraged not to cry over things like death or illness in the family, but getting dressed down for misbehaviour and bursting into tears is fine.

Even EBD alludes to the fact that Joey can be overly thorough (and more than a little tactless) in a dressing down when she's head-girl - there can be a fine line between telling someone off and bullying, and she didn't have a good sense for it.

Which brings me to another irritation. Very Happy

In latter years there are repeated references to Joey as a student being a fantastic headgirl, prime butter in, taking care of other girls and looking out for them and with a wonderful empathy. But when she's a student, she's described as hating sheepdogging, has to be coaxed into taking responsibility, and tends to clash with girls who don't like her. Her empathy is spotty - she is tenderhearted, and very passionate about those she cares for, like Robin or Madge or Juliet. But she doesn't show a lot of empathy for girls like Grizel, or Thekla, or Stacie, or Joyce, or Elaine, or Anne, or even Simone in the early days.

She does do some good things as headgirl, but in the first summer term, for example, when she's worried about Robin, she's all over the place, first distracted and irritable, and then wild and uncontrolled in relief. And there's her tactlessness:

In Exploits, to Thekla

Quote:

"What a disgusting little object," she said in German in which they
had all been speaking. "I never saw such disgraceful manners
anywhere!"

In Lintons to Kitty (who is already weeping copiously and is about 11 at the time)

Quote:

I'm too disgusted with your behaviour. You make me feel sick! Please go away, and don't let us see anything more of you this week as can be helped. You are a disgrace to the School, and the sooner you realise it the better for you. Now go!"

and to Joyce

Quote:

Joyce, you seem to be somewhat above yourself, and the only thing I can suggest is that you should try to realise that you are only a Middle -- and a very new Middle at that. It's rather too early for you to have assimilated our ideals, I suppose, though your sister doesn't seem to have had such trouble. Just get it into your head that all such things as passing notes are despised here, and the people who do them are considered despicable. And remember that you are really a very insignificant person, as well.

#97: Author: Tamzin, Location: Edinburgh

Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 8:39 am
—

Bee wrote:

I agree. At that age I would have died rather than cry in front of anyone else. In fact I rather remember resolving never to cry about anything even in private! In the end I couldn't help crying when my cat died but apart from that I stuck to my resolve for quite a long time. And I cry very rarely even now and always in private!

#98: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 12:17 pm
—
I think Jo does have a lot of empathy - we actually see her empathise with Grizel quite a lot, when she's really just a kid. And she takes on Joyce and gets into her head even though, from Lintons, we can tell that she really dislikes her. (And I don't blame her).

While I do think Joey's treatment of Kitty is a bit harsh, it did at least teach her a lesson. When you think about how the school frowns on that type of behaviour, and how Kitty must have known it, she kind of deserves it, though Joey could have been gentler. On the other hand I fully support her comments to Joyce and Thekla, but I'm biased. Very Happy

What annoys me about the crying is how, in the later Swiss books, it's always the 'Continental' girls who cry - unless it's a particulary drippy English girl (because they are all English, practically).

#99: Author: Liseke,

Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:15 pm
—
Why is 'Plato' referred to as 'Cicero' in CS and Jo?

#100: Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England

Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:20 pm
—
Because EBD mixed up her Ancient Philosophers - which is rendered all the more amusing by the fact that Plato's Greek and Cicero was Roman!

Ray *suspects Cicero also post-dates Plato quite significantly*

#101: Author: JackieP, Location: Kingston upon Hull

Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:54 pm
—
There's the niggle in Barbara when Christine and Catriona get split up - and first one of them's in the dormitory with ML & Co, and then suddenly it's the other one.

JackieP

#102: Author: Sunglass, Location: Usually London

Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 12:09 pm
—
I love this thread! As someone said above, I also wondered whether there was something I was missing as a child reading the CS and baffling myself with the wandering ages and names!

Two of mine:

Biddy O'Ryan's (or, as someone said, O'Hara's) Incredible Intermittent Stage-Irish Accent - surely if the CS adopted her aged ten, and thereafter she was either at the village school (German-speaking) or the CS itself, then Oxford, then Australia, then the Swiss CS, it's highly unlikely that she will still regularly speak like something out of a bad production of Playboy of the Western World aged twenty six, especially having spent her school years being regularly scolded for it.

And, oh God, EBD's French! I appreciate that much of time she's showing schoolgirls whose French isn't necessarily good, but she has Mademoiselle saying the most pidgin-ish things in her native language, and even inventing new grammatical forms - 'est-ce que' does not take the subjunctive! I laughed hollowly at the general staff horror at Emerence's bad essay on the farm-yard picture. OK, she was inventing new words for 'hen' and 'sheep dog' etc but it's not all that different to the kinds of oddities EBD's native speakers produce regularly! Thankfully, she seems to have been too unsure of her German to put in more than a few phrases - though the 'Onkel Riese/Reise' issue doesn't bode well.

In view of EBD's own errors, I've also always been amused by Joey writing her first school story, and finding that she's 'mixed up two of the prefects' and must either rewrite that chapter or everything after it. I was wondering where EBD would even start, and how different the CS would be if everyone was re-aged according to their original dates of birth, and there turned out to be in fact, several different Mademoiselle Le/LaPattres...

#103: Author: Miriam, Location: Jerusalem, Israel

Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 8:14 pm
—
I haven't read this thread through in ages, so it might have been mentioned, but I was amazed to discover that Jo began to recover from her illness after Jacks (supposed) death, due to "a wiry constitution" Shocked

Jo; of the bronchitis after standing by the door for a moment, of a dozen near fatel illnesses, whose poor health neccesitated going to Austria in the first place, has suddenly developed a wiry constitution? What is happening here? Rolling Eyes

#104: Author: NineLivesBurra, Location: York, North Yorks

Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:46 pm
—
I was thinking about the issue of Robin being treated as a baby until she was nearly 11.....I worked it out once, Robin would have been born in about 1927 and it would have been normal for girls to be treated like that. There is a scene where the Madge, Joey and the Robin go to spend Christmas with Frieda and her family and Madge wakes up to the shocl of her life seeing Joey in a Pinafore....lol.

One of my favourite EBDism is the issue of Clem Barras' father's name...lol....."Mark my word's it will or my name is not Adrian Charles Barrass" and you know what? His name is not Adrian Charles Barrass but Miles Barrass....... Smile

#105: Author: KB, Location: Melbourne, Australia

Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 11:44 pm
—

NineLivesBurra wrote:

One of my favourite EBDism is the issue of Clem Barras' father's name...lol....."Mark my word's it will or my name is not Adrian Charles Barrass" and you know what? His name is not Adrian Charles Barrass but Miles Barrass....... Smile

Perhaps Miles was his artist name. Maybe there was another Adrian Barrass when he began and so he had to adopt Miles as a nom de plume.

#106: Author: NineLivesBurra, Location: York, North Yorks

Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 5:32 pm
—
I think EBDs propensity for long sentences is a difficult one to cope with at time....lol.

#107: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:51 am
—
Don't know whether this is a real EBDism, but in the early books, at least, people have to have emergency operations for appendicitis because they have been overeating.

I wonder if she had a poor digestion, so put her own troubles into the books.

#108: Author: Mona, Location: Hertfordshire

Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:03 pm
—
I'm not sure if this is an EBDism or not, but I've just read Rivals in hardback for the first time and was struck by this passage, where Mr Eastly, the Protestant chaplain, comes to the school to celebrate Evensong, while the Catholics go to Benediction.

Quote:

In the little chapel belonging to the school, besides the Saints and the odd 20 or so members of the Church of England that were among the girls of the Chalet School, as well as the staff from both schools, there were Dick Bettany...; Dr Maynard, who could be spared from the Sanatorium since there were no very bad cases at present...

Emphasis mine.

If Dr Maynard had come down especially to attend a church service, why was he attending Evensong in the CS chapel rather than going to Benediction with the Catholics? We're told later in the series that he's been a Catholic since boyhood, if I remember rightly, so I wondered if EBD decided he was Catholic later and simply forgot that she'd made him apparently CofE earlier in the series.

#109: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:40 pm
—
I think EBD changed her mind later on - both Jack and Mollie Maynard seem to be C of E early on. I would think that she decided to make Jack a Catholic when she decided that she was eventually going to pair him up with Joey, and just conveniently ignored her earlier references to him attending Protestant services.

#110: Author: Holly,

Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:06 am
—

Miriam wrote:

I haven't read this thread through in ages, so it might have been mentioned, but I was amazed to discover that Jo began to recover from her illness after Jacks (supposed) death, due to "a wiry constitution" Shocked

That which does not kill you makes you stronger.

After all Joey's near death experiences, she must have been Superwoman.

#111: Author: JackieP, Location: Kingston upon Hull

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 1:03 pm
—
Found another one - Frieda arriving twice at the Sonnalpe in Exploits. First she takes the girls off who are staying with Gottfried and Gisela and who have arrived on coach - and within a couple of paragraphs she's arriving on foot with the rest of the sixth, and showing off her coronet of plaits...

JackieP

#112: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 2:49 pm
—
One in Reunion I don't think has been mentioned. The triplets don't go on the walk to the Auberge when Bruno nearly hurls himself over the mountainside, but afterwards they're talking about it as if they were there.

#113: Author: JackieP, Location: Kingston upon Hull

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 12:16 pm
—
And yet another...

In Jo Returns it's stated that Anne was slated to be HG but wasn't because of her mad escapade (not that it was madder than some of the things Jo did). But in New House it's stated that Anne is helping Marie with the Games - is Captaining the Tennis Six and fully expects to be Games Prefect next term Confused

JackieP

#114: Author: Rosalin, Location: Swansea

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 2:11 pm
—
The treatment of Anne over that incident always annoys me Evil or Very Mad

Another one from Jo Returns:

When the Sonnalpe children all get measles, Jackie escapes. Jo comments on this to Madge who tells her that some people are naturally immune to some things. For instance she (Madge) has been around mumps several times but never had it. So what was wrong with her over Christmas just before the start of Head Girl?

#115: Author: leahbelle, Location: Kilmarnock

Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 5:26 pm
—
I've just started a new read through and I am keeping my eagle eye out for any new EBD-isms Shocked

. Only just a few chapters into School At and everything seems ok so far Cool

#116: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 11:49 am
—
Not sure it's really fair to blame EBD for this one, as so much time had passed between the two incidents, and maybe the rules had changed.

In New House, the prefects are angry when Matron Besly goes into their bedrooms and confiscates their library books, because they're supposed to be exempt from all bedroom supervision and Matron, according to Frieda, has no right to go into their rooms.

In Prefects, Matey has evidently been into Len's room and done a drawer inspection because she hauls Len away from supervising prep to tidy them.

(I know the plot required Len to be called away, but I think Matey should have waited until Len was free. EBD could have come up with a more appropriate reason for Len to be called away - have Joey needing to speak to her on the phone, or Hilda wanting her for something, perhaps.)

#117: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 7:02 pm
—
Was EBD perhaps trying to remind us that Pefect Len did have some faults? Ie unitidiness?

Or was this such a common device of hers that she used it unthinkingly?

#118: Author: Torri, Location: Connecticut

Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 7:39 pm
—
I've got a couple.

First, from Exile, where apparently Frieda's suffered from amnesia

Quote:

‘Not a word. I heard from Frieda last week— she wrote to congratulate me on being the mother of three—and she said that no one knew anything about him.’

Quote:

‘The babes!’ cried Jo. ‘Wait, everyone! I simply must show you at once! I hope no one’s given the show away!’
....
Frieda grabbed Jack Maynard’s arm. ‘Jack! Have you and Joey a baby?—No; but she said “babes!” Twins, then, like Peggy and Rix! Oh, why did no one tell me!'

Jo, you gave the show away yourself and Frieda, they did tell you!

And then rereading Reunion, I picked up on something I've never noticed before, but rather amuses me!

Rosalie's telling Grizel and co. the story from New Mistress when Mary-Lou saved Kathie from going over the edge. But according to her, Nancy had bought the prefects up along with Kathie, and not Kathie by herself! Smile

#119: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:58 pm
—

JayB wrote:

In New House, the prefects are angry when Matron Besly goes into their bedrooms and confiscates their library books, because they're supposed to be exempt from all bedroom supervision and Matron, according to Frieda, has no right to go into their rooms.

Somethingthat's always bothered me about this episode is that Joey minds Matron confiscating her book, singular, the one she was reading, but she doesn't mention the whole bookshelf she also has in her room... did Matron soend ages emptying it, ot did Joey never get round to putting books on the shelf?

#120: Author: Fi, Location: Somerset

Posted: Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:28 pm
—
One that really gets me is from Head Girl. Madge is spending some time at the school as Jem is away from home because of work. Grizel gets hit by Deira's stone and the next thing we know is that Jem is being called down from the Sonnalpe to check her over. Did Jem come back early and if so why did Madge not go home.

#121: Author: Tara, Location: Malvern, Worcestershire

Posted: Sat Oct 06, 2007 11:22 pm
—
Oh, there must be a drabble in that one! Here, bunny, bunny, bunny ...

#122: Author: Mona, Location: Hertfordshire

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:19 am
—
In New Chalet School, when Jem and Gottfried are looking for the Balbini twins and Sybil, Jem sends Gottfried back to the Sonnalpe to hear Dr Gray's report after they find out about the smallpox case at the gasthaus. Gottfried sets off on foot up the mountainside.
Not four pages later, after Jem meets Herr Anserl with the children, Gottfried appears with the runabout, and takes them back to St Scholastikas.

#123: Author: Hannah-Lou, Location: Glasgow

Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 5:09 pm
—
At the beginning of New Chalet School, Madge, Joey and Robin get ready to go to the train station to meet the School, but only Madge and Joey make it to the station. What happens to Robin? Do they push her into the lake or something???

#124: Author: Holly,

Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:03 pm
—

Hannah-Lou wrote:

At the beginning of New Chalet School, Madge, Joey and Robin get ready to go to the train station to meet the School, but only Madge and Joey make it to the station. What happens to Robin? Do they push her into the lake or something???

Could you blame them if they had? Robin could be very sweet at times, but she was often so good that I was ready to scream if I read the word "angel-child" again or how well-trained to obedience she was, etc.

#125: Author: JackieP, Location: Kingston upon Hull

Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:00 pm
—
I suppose I always assumed she's wandered off to talk to her own cronies, and Madge & Joey just hadn't picked her up by the time the chapter ended - but she should have been with them waving on the platform - so who knows...?

JackieP

#126: Most irritating EBDism Author: Jenefer, Location: London

Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 5:49 pm
—
In Peggy of the CS, Mary Lou and her friends are in Upper Third, in Carola storms the CS, they are in the Fourth for the Sale but in the Wrong CS, they have been demoted to Upper Third again.

#127: Author: Billie, Location: The south of England.

Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:37 pm
—
How many different dormitaries had their ceilings fall in due to Joey and co's escapades directly above? I'm sure both her dormitary, and the one beneath it, change in subsequent retellings of the story.

(edited for clarification.)

Last edited by Billie on Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:29 pm; edited 1 time in total

#128: Author: Bee, Location: Canberra, Australia

Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:19 am
—
I know, a ceiling falling? Surely that would cost the earth to get fixed... and yet, the authorities hardly take notice of it!

The other one I noticed is how people (especially Jo) are constantly described as whistling like a blackbird. I don't know how a blackbird whistles - I assume it's pleasant, considering it's Joey of the golden choir-boy's voice! Laughing

#129: Author: Bess, Location: Cambridge UK

Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:08 pm
—
Blackbirds are very piercing - we have a few who live outside my bedroom window, and when the cats are stalking their young, they make enough noise to make me wish the cats would eat the whole family! :p

I'm sorry if it's been mentioned before, but I just came across the irritating little EBD-ism in 'Camp' which I'd never noticed before - when Madge specifically states no-one below 4th form is going, then they meet girls from the 3rd form at the lake-side.

#130: Author: Susan, Location: Carlisle

Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:47 am
—

Mia wrote:

Have just realised I forgot to reply to this post when I first saw it.

Me!!!! I was a Chalet Club member and have a piece in a newletter which therefore is in the book.

#131: Author: Billie, Location: The south of England.

Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 8:12 pm
—
I'm reading Redheads for the first time and they make a big deal about how the staff can't call Flavia Copper because they only use short forms of their names, and not nicknames. Well, by what stretch of the imagination is Tom short for Lucinda?

Er... sorry. That's what happens when you leap straight into the thread without starting at the beginning and seeing what started the thread in the first place. Embarassed

#132: Author: Ciorstaidh, Location: London

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:14 pm
—

Billie wrote:

Er... sorry. That's what happens when you leap straight into the thread without starting at the beginning and seeing what started the thread in the first place. Embarassed

Me: LOL...but don't you love it when a thread comes full circle of its own accord?

After all -- it clearly annoys more than one person! (And me too, and as for the end of the book -- I won't spoil you -- good grief, it's worse than her later Chudleigh Hold books)

#133: Author: Joyce, Location: Hong Kong

Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:19 pm
—
I've just found one in the hardback of Wins the Trick.

Solange tells Audrey that her Aunt Melanie had told her the night before that she will be going to the CS the following term.

A few days later, Solange 'announces' as major news that her aunt had told her that morning that she will be going to the CS. And it's EXACTLY the same conversation - it's like they are having a Groundhog Day.

Another thing that has ALWAYS bugged me is in Three Go To when Vi Lucy has trouble translating a basic sentence in French though we are told throughout the La Rochelle series that the Lucy family was brought up speaking French as well as English.

And don't even get me started on the way the ages change Smile

Cheers,
Joyce

#134: Author: Miriam, Location: Jerusalem, Israel

Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:33 pm
—

Quote:

Another thing that has ALWAYS bugged me is in Three Go To when Vi Lucy has trouble translating a basic sentence in French though we are told throughout the La Rochelle series that the Lucy family was brought up speaking French as well as English.

That may actually seem more reasonable. Vi would have been very young and only beginning to speak when they had to leave Geurnsey along with the CS. Once they were in England, and France was under Nazi occupation, they may well have dropped their french, in the same way the CS did. To be speaking french all over a small english town during WW2 would not have been seen as a good move.

The question is, of course, exactly when after the war they moved back to Geurnsey - it probably wasn't immediate - and if they resumed their french once they were back.

#135: Author: Mona, Location: Hertfordshire

Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:19 pm
—

Quote:

The question is, of course, exactly when after the war they moved back to Geurnsey - it probably wasn't immediate - and if they resumed their french once they were back.

The Lucys' Aunt Anne resumed it enough that Barbara spoke reasonably fluently when she arrived, however many years later that was (4 or 5?)

#136: Author: Joyce, Location: Hong Kong

Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:59 am
—
Julie speaks good French and it's mentioned that her whole family was brought up bilingual.

The way the passage is written in Three Go To it's as if the language is brand new to Vi and she's never heard a word of it in her life, which can't be true.

Cheers,
Joyce

#137: Author: JB, Location: Cumbria

Posted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:18 pm
—
Joey and Co in Tirol - when Joey leaves Charles behind, she says he'll be fine with the Rosomons as Lawrie is a doctor. But Daisy's a doctor too, who won awards for her work with children.

#138: Author: JoMoran, Location: Wiltshire, England

Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 8:36 pm
—
The one thing that really grates on me and makes my teeth go on edge (like when our maths teacher used to run her finger nails down the blackboard) is her continual use of the phrase

' a row to hoe' or variations of ...

I never actually understood what it meant. It appears fairly early on and then seems to disappear in the middle and reappear annoyingly in the last few books - aargh ! She seems to use it mainly when talking about either Joey or Margot and then a few random other people - all of whom turn out much nicer young ladies for a few terms at the chalet school - shame the place doesn't exist - my 15 year old could do with a dose !

#139: Author: Billie, Location: The south of England.

Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 10:10 pm
—
Frau Berlin's hair turns from "Yellow" to grey during the course of School At, and no mention of a Miss Wilson-type overnight change.

#140: Author: Lottie, Location: Humphrey's Corner

Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:08 pm
—

Billie wrote:

Frau Berlin's hair turns from "Yellow" to grey during the course of School At, and no mention of a Miss Wilson-type overnight change.

Maybe she ran out of hair dye during her holiday. Wink

#141: Author: Billie, Location: The south of England.

Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:41 pm
—
That seems quite probable. Wink

I also noticed in Rivals that in one chapter the quartette are in the green dormitory planning their revenge on the blues and yellows, and in the next, or possibly even the same chapter, the green dormitory is full of middles and Joey and co. are in the yellow.

#142: Author: fio, Location: swansea united kingdom

Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:50 pm
—

JoMoran wrote:

She seems to use it mainly when talking about either Joey or Margot and then a few random other people - all of whom turn out much nicer young ladies for a few terms at the chalet school - shame the place doesn't exist - my 15 year old could do with a dose !

And if they went Co-Ed they could have my 13 year old Jonathan as well!!!!! Wink

I think the phrase basically means "Doesn't she have a hard time of it".

#143: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:50 pm
—
One thing I have never understood id that there are six members of the Sixth in Rivals: Mary, Deira, the mysterious Natasha and Joey are presumably four members, but Marie also appears to be a member which is strange given that she's the least intelligent of the Quartette as that leaves Simone (the cleverest) and Frieda (average) fighting it out for the other place. Confused

#144: EBD'isms Author: JoMoran, Location: Wiltshire, England

Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 8:45 pm
—
I may be just a tad confused because it was late at night when I read Reunion and forgive me if this has been raised before, but does EBD mix up Mollie Maynard and Con Stewart ? In Reunion Mollie Maynard appears as Mollie Mackenzie but I thought she married a Macdonald (the girls discuss her going to NZ in camp) and Simone refers to Mr Mackenzie from Singapore coming to get Charlie in the beginning of 'At War;'. So who is this Mollie Mackenzie person ? A two for the price of one ???

Question

#145: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 10:12 pm
—
Mollie's husband changes both his first name and his surname several times during the course of the series Laughing

#146: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:23 pm
—

Alison H wrote:

Mollie's husband changes both his first name and his surname several times during the course of the series Laughing

No, no no no - this is a common mistake people make - Mollie marries a number of different men during her lifetime - it's the reason she was shipped off to New Zealand - so the CS didn't become contaminated by a serial bigamist. Wink

#147: Author: abbeybufo, Location: in a world of her own

Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:11 am
—

Lesley wrote:

Alison H wrote:

Mollie's husband changes both his first name and his surname several times during the course of the series Laughing

#148: Author: macyrose, Location: Great White North (Canada)

Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:24 am
—
Lesley wrote:

Quote:

You must have been reading that legendary book Scandals at the Chalet School! Wink

#149: Author: JackieP, Location: Kingston upon Hull

Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:14 pm
—
Sorry to resurrect this, but I've found a beauty...

in Wrong, when the Guides are going camping, Elfie Woodward goes forward with Julie Lucy as part of the Laburnums to take the poles off the hand-cart and, then, less than 100 words later, she's leading the Poplars with Bride... obviously a very keen Guide....

JackieP

#150: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:10 pm
—

Loryat wrote:

One thing I have never understood is that there are six members of the Sixth in Rivals: Mary, Deira, the mysterious Natasha and Joey are presumably four members, but Marie also appears to be a member which is strange given that she's the least intelligent of the Quartette as that leaves Simone (the cleverest) and Frieda (average) fighting it out for the other place. Confused

Frieda is definitely a member of the Sixth too.

Reading the Frieda-Gets-Chicken-Pox passage, the Sixth seems to consist of all the prefects plus Vanna and Natasha - certainly, everyone in Joey's dormitory - Matron says to Joey, her dormy chums (who are Mary, Marie, Simone and Frieda-in-the-San, I think), Deira and Carla: ‘Are you all prefects here? Where is Vanna? Who else is in the Sixth besides you?’ to which Jo replies "Natasha".

I take that as being that they are all in the Sixth, and are all prefects apart from Natasha...

Of course, the numbers are still got to be an EBDism - and surely the CS wouldn't have the whole Sixth Form be prefects apart from one girl.

Despite EBD's statement about the number in the Sixth, in my planning for Juliet, I listed 8 prefects / sixth formers in Rivals - Mary, Deira, Vanna, Jo, Simone, Frieda, Marie, Carla.

Natasha, I accidental-on-purpose overlooked due to her only being mentioned by name about twice...

Very Happy

The CBB -> Anything Else

output generated using printer-friendly topic mod. All times are GMT + 1 Hour

Page 1 of 1