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Hair Washing at the Chalet School
http://www.the-cbb.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=7191

Author:  cal562301 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:28 am ]
Post subject:  Hair Washing at the Chalet School

When I was washing my hair this morning, it suddenly occurred to me that this activity is seldom mentioned in the CS books, unless someone has some kind of accident which makes it necessary.

They surely wouldn't have time to wash it properly during their morning bath and dry it whilst doing dorm duties. Yet, some of them have very long hair and others very curly hair, which would require a great deal of care. Even those who had 'normal' hair would need to wash it regularly. Yet all we hear of is that they brushed it each evening before bed.

How do you think they managed this in the CS regime? When I was a teenager, I had very long hair myself, and I remember the time and effort it took to keep it clean and tidy.

Author:  Alison H [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

People would usually only have washed their once a week in CS times, certainly not every day or every other day as most people do now, but, as you say, there's very little mention of hair washing at all, and they must have washed their hair sometimes! It must have been done in the evenings - there's the odd mention of people having hot baths in the evenings (is it Lavender who lets the bath overflow) - and presumably they then had to sit by a fire to dry it. It must have taken ages with the amount of hair some people had :roll: , and I certainly can't imagine Matey let people hang about or go to bed with wet hair.

Author:  JB [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

The drying of hair must have been incredibly difficult to arrange, with so many girls with extremely long hair. You couldn't fit many girls at a time around the common room stove to dry it. No wonder EBD didn't write about it. Just thinking about how this could have worked is making my head spin.

In one of the La Rochelle books, Jose Atherton says she doesn't need to have her washed as it was done only two weeks ago.

ETA Elle's drabble made me think of hair-washing after Pan put the bacon under her hat.

Author:  Mel [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

It's interesting that it is always phrased 'having her hair washed' as though the concept of washing one's own hair is an alien concept. This was true in the era. Adult women would go possibly fortnightly for a wash and set, or in Madge's case, just a wash. At home, girls would have their hair washed by mother/sister/Nanny. Would the Matrons do it 2-3 times a term? In The Chalet Book for girls EBD says quite firmly that hair should be washed every 2-3 weeks. (Whether it needs it or not?) I am always surprised that Jo washes her hair in the middle of the night at the convent in 'Adrienne' and then goes to bed with wet knee-length hair.

Author:  cal562301 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 1:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Mel wrote:
It's interesting that it is always phrased 'having her hair washed' as though the concept of washing one's own hair is an alien concept. This was true in the era. Adult women would go possibly fortnightly for a wash and set, or in Madge's case, just a wash. At home, girls would have their hair washed by mother/sister/Nanny. Would the Matrons do it 2-3 times a term? In The Chalet Book for girls EBD says quite firmly that hair should be washed every 2-3 weeks. (Whether it needs it or not?) I am always surprised that Jo washes her hair in the middle of the night at the convent in 'Adrienne' and then goes to bed with wet knee-length hair.


This reminded my of my mum, who, until she became too frail, went fortnightly to the local hairdresser for a 'shampoo and set' and a perm once a month.

As a child of the 60s, I remember my hair being washed once a week, as part of the 'weekly bath' routine.

The only time I remember someone else (other than a hairdresser when I go for a cut and blow dry) washing my hair as an adult is when I was suffering from shingles on a part of my body that made it extremely painful to raise my arms above my head. And I remember that I only asked a good friend to do it, when I was absolutely desperate because my hair was so greasy!

Edited once in last paragraph.

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 1:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Mel wrote:
Would the Matrons do it 2-3 times a term? In The Chalet Book for girls EBD says quite firmly that hair should be washed every 2-3 weeks. (Whether it needs it or not?)


That sounds likely to me, on some kind of rota. It would also explain why the default mode, especially earlier in the series, is that (British) schoolgirls quite often tend to wear their hair shortish, for convenience, and only start to grow it, with all the extra bother of washing, towards the end of their schooldays, when they are having to take on an 'adult' attitude to their appearance (and heading towards the marriage market...) I could imagine Matey groaning at heads of hair like Frieda or Marie's or the long-haired people who are cornfloured by Joey and co!

Although, thinking that through, it's never seen as unusual later in the series that Mary-Lou has Kenwigses and then a long single ponytail all along until almost the end of her schooldays, is it? Or are we supposed to see it it as part of her 'old-fashionedness', being brought up by a grandmother and an older mother? I think Verity also has long hair all along.

Author:  RubyGates [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

:shock: at washing hair every two to three weeks! Mind you my dad, who ws born in 1923, used to wash his very short hair once a week. The he'd put Vitalis on it every morning in between washes.

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I'm just wondering what people would do if they were like - is it Clover? - in the Katy books and had to sleep with their hair in rollers to make it curl (sorry, I need a re-read). Would they have to miss that out when they had their hair washed?

Although saying that, my own hair couldn't, even by the optimistic, be described as short and yet if it isn't tied up it can dry in only an hour or so. It's not very thick, though, which I suppose would make a difference. So maybe it wouldn't be as difficult?

Author:  Miriam [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

In the summer my hair - long enough to sit on, and thick and fine - will dry in a couple of hours. In the winter I go to bed with it wet, and it it is often still damp in the morning.

I doubt that the people with very long fine hair would have waited until it was absolutely bone dry. Once it reached the 'dampish' stage they would probably have left it to finish drying by itself. This is probably when anyone who was so inclined would have put in curl rags - but I imagine that curling ones hair would ahve been a frowned upon activity at the CS.

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

ChubbyMonkey wrote:
I'm just wondering what people would do if they were like - is it Clover? - in the Katy books and had to sleep with their hair in rollers to make it curl (sorry, I need a re-read). Would they have to miss that out when they had their hair washed?


Why would they, though? They'd towel dry it by the fire/stove and presumably put in the curlers/curling papers at bedtime as usual - they would even by more effective if the hair was still slightly damp. (Despite the fact that I had curly hair as a child, my mother, herself sraight-haired and obsessed with ringlet, used to curl my hair with rags or rollers overnight for special occasions, which was more than a bit sadistic.)

Though one has the impression that artificial means of hair-curling are frowned on at the CS, whether they're perms or whatever it is Lavender puts in her hair to make ringlets at night!

Author:  JB [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I don't think Matey would have approved of curlers. How did they manage with Lavender's ringlets? Didn't Auntie wrap them around rags every night?

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I think there's a quite snide reference to Lavender wearing curlers at night in the early days of her time at the CS - presumably she's able to manage them herself. I can't see Matey helping out, or even another girl, although other people in a dormitory quite often help out with plaiting one another's hair. (It always seems odd to me that girls were allowed to go to school without being able to manage their own hair in terms of plaiting and daily care, but there are a few who seem to need help with the basics, and get it from others in their dormitory.)

Author:  judithR [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

ChubbyMonkey wrote:
is it Clover? - in the Katy books and had to sleep with their hair in rollers to make it curl


Yes it was. I think it said "curl papers" which I'd assumed were like the rags my grandmother used in (futile) attempts to give me ringlets. And hideously uncomfortable they were too. One dis have to sleep face down.

We also used pipe cleaners which were wire covered by something fluffy. Effective ifthe ends of one's hair were rolled in them overnight but alas if it was even slightly damp the next day my hair would be straight by breakfast time.

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I'd have had to have help, Cosimo! I can do pigtails with some success, but my hair's too long for me to manage a single plait down my back, which I always assumed was the problem with the girls. If you tug it over one shoulder to plait it then the ponytail gets dragged off centre and looks mightily odd, but with long hair you'd have to dislocate both elbows to be able to plait effectively straight centre.

Thanks Judith! I always wondered what they were, but always thought of the rollers, for example with Vera in Coronation St., who I always associate them with for some reason.

Author:  Emma A [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

judithR wrote:
...I think it said "curl papers" which I'd assumed were like the rags my grandmother used in (futile) attempts to give me ringlets. And hideously uncomfortable they were too. One did have to sleep face down.

We also used pipe cleaners which were wire covered by something fluffy. Effective ifthe ends of one's hair were rolled in them overnight but alas if it was even slightly damp the next day my hair would be straight by breakfast time.

This reminds me of one of (IIRC) Shirley Edwards' 'My Naughty Little Sister' stories: she gets her mother to put her hair in rags to imitate the ringlets of another little girl, and realises that this other child is so good because she's so tired (having not been able to sleep due to the curl papers)!

Author:  Cumbrian Rachel [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 4:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

ChubbyMonkey wrote:
I'd have had to have help, Cosimo! I can do pigtails with some success, but my hair's too long for me to manage a single plait down my back, which I always assumed was the problem with the girls. If you tug it over one shoulder to plait it then the ponytail gets dragged off centre and looks mightily odd, but with long hair you'd have to dislocate both elbows to be able to plait effectively straight centre.


I have hair long enough to sit on and find it very straightforward to do one plait - I start off by plaiting it heading upwards from my head until I've got enough plait for it to reach over my shoulder and plait it down from there. Kind of hard to explain, but easy with a lot of practice (it's been my normal hairstyle for quite a few years now). I find pigtails much more tricky.

Author:  Miriam [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 4:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Yes,I'll agree with that - I do the same, except that I plait downwards.You only need to get the first few inches established while centered, then you you can move it around without the plait being affected. You do have to make those first few inches firm though - if you plait them loosely, you lose the whole foundation of the plait, and it can move all around your head.

While I do this every morning without even thinking about it now, when I was eleven or so I would have found it very difficult to make one plait (or even two) controlling all the sections of hair, and making it firm enough to look tidy for at least a few hours. It took a long time to work out how to hold and manipulate three sections in two hands, and hold all the pieces of hair in one section together, while weaving it into a strong plait. If I was in a dormitory with a few other girls in the same situation, I'd much rather have done someone else's, where at least I could see what I was doing, and if any hair escaped, and let them do mine.

(Incidently, I didn't start plaiting my hair on a reular basis until I was at least twenty.)

Author:  LauraMcC [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I still can't do anything with my hair. It's usually kept pretty short, which isn't a problem, but even when it grows pretty long, I can't tie it up, and have to leave it loose. I'm not very dextrous, though, which is probably why. (And I never washed my hair by myself until I was about 17/18, which seems incredible now, but it was just too difficult for worlds! :oops: )

Author:  Joey [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I'm another who tightly plaits my hair downwards for the first few inches and then pulls it over my shoulder to finish. I've been wearing my hair like this for about ten years, and for about six years before that I plaited my hair to sleep, so I do it quite fast and don't think about it. However, it was very hard to start with, and I certainly couldn't have done it when I was a child.

In fact, when I was eight I went away for a week-long camp which included swimming and other watery sports. It was a school trip and the whole of my class was going. My parents said I could only go if I agreed to have my hair cut first, because there was no way I could have looked after my hair myself (it's extremely thick and curly, and I have a double crown into the bargain). I then had short hair for a few years and started growing it when I was twelve: it grows so slowly that I was sixteen before it was long enough to tie it back in a ponytail!

I know that most of the CS girls we see are eleven and older, but it seems absolutely realistic to me that people with long hair help each other out.

Author:  cal562301 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

This discussion reminds me of historical times, when people only bathed once a year - and probably washed their hair? Certainly, 'the working class' didn't bathe too often until comparatively recently, and if the likes of Georgette Heyer are to be believed, neither did the aristocracy!

Author:  cestina [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

At boarding school from 1953-59 we were only allowed to wash our hair once every 3 weeks and it was done on a rota system with about four girls doing it at the same time and drying it in front of Matron's fire or with Matron wielding the one hairdryer possessed by the boarding house.

If your hairwashing week coincided with your period you were not allowed to wash your hair that week as it was considered dangerously unhealthy to do so when you were "unwell". The same applied if you had a cold. And having missed your slot you might have to go for six weeks without your hair being washed. Hence the use of the white powder called "Dry shampoo" which one could buy in chemists and Woolworths (how I regret the passing of that chain :( )

A friend of mine arrived, age 11, with plaits that she could manage herself, but only if she plaited them to the front. This was considered too untidy and so one of us in her dormitory had to plait them for her - to the back. In her second term she came back with short hair!

Author:  fraujackson [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I remember the CS girls having their hair shampooed by Matron after they'd got flour or something into it; but on other occasions (I think it's in one of the early books) it's only *brushed* to remove the offending material. So hairwahing must have been something unusual otherwise it wouldn't have been mentioned as a consequence of their misdemeanours.

Are they described as drying it with a towel only ? I don't remember anyone having to sit in front of Matey's fire, but it must have happened otherwise they would have frozen to death in the winter, surely...

It's the cold/lukewarm baths in the morning that would have done for me, I'm afraid. I'm sure it was healthy (and probably you'd be quick !), but I don't fancy the idea...

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 8:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

My mother, aged almost 82, still does get her hair shampooed and set every week, and only washes it herself when on holiday or at "the very end" of a perm, when as she says, it's not worth paying for it. She's been going to the same hairdresser for at least 40 years!

When I was at school in the 1960s hair was washed once a week, and it was thought to be bad for it to wash it more often - given the slightly harsh shampoos of the day, it probably was! And the lack of hoses or showers to do it in - bending over a basin and using a toothmug to wet and then rinse it isn't much fun, and takes ages. Plus drying it in front of the gas-fire in the housemistress' sitting-room - and all too often scorching it so the room would smell of burnt hair when you went in there for prayers before supper!

I didn't start washing my hair almost every day until we got a shower put in here!

Author:  emma t [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 8:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I am another who is baffled about the girls not having their hair washed! I would not have liked it one bit; as I wash mine nearly every day; though I guess that if I had lived back then, i would have thought it the norm, and so be used to it.

Madge had her washed in one of the early books when Joey was ill and had woken up; I remember her expression as being as one of startlemet that the doctor had requested it to be done :o

Most of the girls had long hair, so no I can imagine it would be difficult to wash it; especially when you get such girls as Maria - that would have been such a struggle for her; how did she manage her hair when they had to rush every morning to get ready?

Plus, when would they have washed it? They seem to be either at lessons, on breaks or on rambles, etc, that they would not have a minute, let alone a few hours to wash and dry their hair, even if done on a rota!

Author:  cal562301 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cestina wrote:
If your hairwashing week coincided with your period you were not allowed to wash your hair that week as it was considered dangerously unhealthy to do so when you were "unwell". The same applied if you had a cold. And having missed your slot you might have to go for six weeks without your hair being washed. Hence the use of the white powder called "Dry shampoo" which one could buy in chemists and Woolworths (how I regret the passing of that chain :( )



I remember this fallacy about not washing your hair if you had a period. I have a feeling there were other 'taboos' which today's teenagers would laugh at, but I've forgotten most of them. One of them was probably swimming, but they didn't have tampons in those days, so it wasn't practical anyway. Does anyone remember any of the other period-related taboos?

I feel sorry for those like Cestina who would have had to go for ages without washing their hair if they had a period in the 'wrong' week.

I wash my hair every other day normally.

Slightly OT, but I always wondered how they dealt with periods/explaining the facts of life at CS, since as far as I can remember, such things are never mentioned. But I guess in EBD's day they wouldn't be mentioned in polite society anyway.

Edited once to correct typos.

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cal562301 wrote:
Slightly OT, but I always wondered how they dealt with periods/explaining the facts of life at CS, since as far as I can remember, such things are never mentioned. But I guess in EBD's day they wouldn't be mentioned in polite society anyway.


I was wondering this the other day, reading about an incredibly innocent character who doesn't understand the motives of some horrible men at all. Personally, I would have said that getting a doctor to explain it clearly and concisely would be the best bet, but I don't know if they would have been trusted with something so delicate?

(Was going to say Dr Jem as he is married and has seen Joey, at least, sans clothes several times, but as I imagine it would come in a package with other things like sex, I can't see Madge being comfortable with the girls knowing that about her!)

Maybe Bill or Matey?

Author:  Nightwing [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

My secret theory is that "English tea at Mrs Maynard's" is actually done for Joey to explain the facts of life to the girls - when she asks them to help wash the babies she gently inquires as to whether they know where babies come from :lol:

I don't know about the Tyrol days, though: I expect some of the girls had a semi-understanding of what was involved, and they passed on their incomplete and often wrong knowledge to other girls, and all of them were in for a bit of a shock once they were married! Or perhaps, once they reached a certain age, they were given a book to read, but nothing was ever discussed.

Of course, they would have had their first periods a lot later in life than girls do now, wouldn't they?

Author:  cestina [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Swimming was certainly "off" when you had your period. The house games captain was responsible for allocating the sports activities in the summer - we had tennis, cricket and swimming and each girl did two things on games afternoons which were four times a week. We had a notebook outside matron's room into which you entered your period when it started and signed off when it was finished so that the games captain didn't allocate you to a swimming session.

I had forgotten all about that notebook until just now!

The hairwashing really wasn't the huge issue that a similar rule would be nowadays. I don't think anyone washed their hair daily as we so easily do now, once a week would have been much more common, if that. Showers were few and far between and they are one of the things that has made hairwashing so simple. You were lucky if you had one of those rubber hose type ones that fitted onto the bathtaps, let alone something more substantial, at home.

I love the theory about English tea at Freudesheim!

Author:  Clare [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Nightwing wrote:
My secret theory is that "English tea at Mrs Maynard's" is actually done for Joey to explain the facts of life to the girls - when she asks them to help wash the babies she gently inquires as to whether they know where babies come from :lol:


Oooh, that makes a lot of sense actually!

Author:  cal562301 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Clare wrote:
Nightwing wrote:
My secret theory is that "English tea at Mrs Maynard's" is actually done for Joey to explain the facts of life to the girls - when she asks them to help wash the babies she gently inquires as to whether they know where babies come from :lol:


Oooh, that makes a lot of sense actually!


To me too. Maybe someone could work this into a drabble. Then it would have to be true, wouldn't it? :lol:

Author:  MJKB [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I went to boarding school at nine. That was back in the mid 60's. We were allocated one bath per week and one hair wash. I distinctly remember the smell of oily hair among the older girls. My second term there I left my hair for almost an entire term without washing it and it wasn't detected by the nuns.
I couldn't imagine not washing my hair nightly as I do now. Perhaps there is truth in what we were told then, narmely that washing ones hair too frequently made it greasier.

Author:  Alison H [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Cestina, I can see the point of that notebook, but how embarrassing to have to record personal details like that :oops: .

Madge was actually packed off to a hotel the Kron Prinz Karl to have her hair shampooed when Joey was ill. Maybe no hair washing took place at the CS at all, and the Brauns did a roaring trade in shampooing services with the girls being sent over in batches every so often :lol: .

Author:  Abi [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Alison H wrote:
Cestina, I can see the point of that notebook, but how embarrassing to have to record personal details like that.


Indeed. :shock: Mind you, could be handy if you hated swimming! I can see dear Gwendoline Mary, for example, taking great advantage. :lol:

Author:  tiffinata [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

While I shampoo my hair every second day I still love going to a GOOD hairdresser for a wash and cut. Where else do you get a lovely hair and head massage?? :lol:

And maybe that was partially why Madge was sent to have her hair washed when Joey was ill!

Author:  Miss Di [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 2:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I only wash my hair once a week - it's too long and thick to do everyday (and I have a long commute so leave home at about 7am). And I wear it in a plait at night so I don't choke!

When I was a Brownie you weren't allowed to go on pack holiday unless you could do your own hair. I think I had crocked pig tails :P

Author:  Catherine [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I once wrote a drabble about the facts of life and the CS (Growing Pains) ... it's not very good but it's lurking in the archives somewhere.

I vaguely remember that after a skiing afternoon or something in one of the later books, Jane Carew washes her hair (or it gets wet) and has someone rub it dry for her.

Author:  claire [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

We used to have it marked in red if we didn't want to go swimming due to a 'period', could only use the excuse once a month though

Author:  Miriam [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Alison H wrote:
Cestina, I can see the point of that notebook, but how embarrassing to have to record personal details like that :oops: .

.


Maybe less embarassing however, than having to go and tell someone. If such things have to be recorded, it does allow for a certain amount of discretion.

Author:  Josette [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

We didn't have to use the communal showers if we were "on", and as they didn't keep any records most of us managed to make this about three weeks out of four!

Author:  Catherine [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

We had communal showers in Upper 3 only and it was horrific! The teacher used to stand waiting for us to come out and hand us our towels!

We had swimming only from Upper 3 to Upper 4 (years 7-9) and if we weren't swimming for whatever reason, we were still expected to go to the swimming baths and sit and watch - which was torture for me as I love swimming and would rather be in the water than sitting watching! If we had our periods, we were allowed to take a note the first time and then we just had to queue up and say we couldn't swim because we had our periods.

The PE teachers always gossiped and it was such a big deal at that age as most of us hadn't had them very long that I hid rather than tell them as it was so embarrassing and I know other people felt the same, although they may have been brave enough not to hide! Fortunately, I think it only happened a couple of times.

Author:  Chris [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I am just reading 'The Scapegoat' by Daphne du Maurier, and someone has booked a hairwash at the hairdresser. Another character asks what she has done that for as it is only 4 or 5 days since she last had it washed! I believe it was written in 1957.

Author:  leahbelle [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

When I was in Primary 7 and first and second year, I had really long thick hair that reached way down past my bum (or bottom if we're being polite) and I remember my mum would only allow me to wash it once a week. I don't know why because I washed it myself and had a bath or shower every day. The thought of only washing it once a week now makes me cringe.

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

We had a similar notebook to Cestina's but I always forgot to sign it! In the summer term the games prefect would ask, after supper, who was not swimming next day, and after a show of hands, would say "Anybody for not the usual reason?" and someone who had had a cold or an earache would have to say so. Then if you weren't swimming you had to go and explain to the games staff, who noted it down on the register. They were apt to be sour if you used any excuse other than the obvious one, which they couldn't argue with. So those of us who used Tampax tended to swim if we felt like it, and excuse ourselves if we didn't, regardless of the time of the month!

We didn't have showers - communal showers were built in the "new" cloakrooms, but I don't think they were ever used. We didn't even undress in the dormitories in front of each other - you swiftly learnt how to wriggle in and out of your nightclothes without exposing yourself! Some houses had private cubicles with their own washbasins, which must have been wonderful - we just had endless dreary beds in dreary dormitories and no privacy.

Author:  cestina [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Mrs Redboots wrote:
So those of us who used Tampax tended to swim if we felt like it, and excuse ourselves if we didn't, regardless of the time of the month!


Lucky you! We weren't allowed to use Tampax.....no nice girl did according to our house staff!

And of course there were no stick-on towels in those days. We had a narrow belt with hooks front and back and the towels (STs) had loops......again, something I haven't thought of for more than 50 years!

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I think that was a difference between the 1950s and the 1960s - or perhaps between schools; we were left pretty much alone on matters of that kind, no need to say when you'd been to the loo or anything like that. The house matrons kept supplies of ordinary STs (as you say, not stick-on or anything), but if you brought your own in, that was fine.

Oddly enough, the one bit of medical interference in my particular boarding-house was that each morning we were issued with a tablespoonful or so of a rather nice mixture you were supposed to gargle with. Actually, nobody ever did unless they actually had a sore throat, but it was faintly disappointing when the practice was stopped in my 2nd year there, and replaced with a roll-call, although you could always get a gargle if you wanted one.

Author:  cal562301 [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 8:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cestina wrote:
Mrs Redboots wrote:
So those of us who used Tampax tended to swim if we felt like it, and excuse ourselves if we didn't, regardless of the time of the month!


Lucky you! We weren't allowed to use Tampax.....no nice girl did according to our house staff!

And of course there were no stick-on towels in those days. We had a narrow belt with hooks front and back and the towels (STs) had loops......again, something I haven't thought of for more than 50 years!


I remember those from the 60s. They were horrible and so bulky.

Author:  judithR [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cestina wrote:
Lucky you! We weren't allowed to use Tampax.....no nice girl did according to our house staff!


Or according to my mother! Our games mistress had a black book into which one's name was entered the first time one "missed" a shower or swimming.

Author:  hac61 [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I had quite heavy, long periods when I was at school. One of the Games Staff was quite good about my saying "pass" two weeks running, but the other one always demanded proof. I hated having to produce a big thick ST from my briefcase in front of the rest of two classes. :oops:

Author:  cestina [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

hac61 wrote:
I had quite heavy, long periods when I was at school. One of the Games Staff was quite good about my saying "pass" two weeks running, but the other one always demanded proof. I hated having to produce a big thick ST from my briefcase in front of the rest of two classes. :oops:


Eeeek! :(

Author:  cal562301 [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

That is terrible. We had to say we had a period and mine started quite late (14) so I pretended for about 2 years that I had one when I didn't! (Most of the class had already started earlier.) Must have got the intervals about right, though, cos no one ever queried it. I guess having a sister 2 years older who started at 11 helped! :oops:

Good job no one asked for proof, although I wouldn't say producing a ST on its own was proof, cos you could do that anyway!

Author:  sealpuppy [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I don't think they washed their hair more than once a month, if that, pre war. There's a hairwashing session in EJO's 'At School with the Roundheads' where the girls wash their hair as 'it hadn't been washed since they arrived', which was at least a month, possibly more. :shock: The theory was for years, (I think) that the natural oils in the hair would keep the hair smooth. Victorian women used various fixatives to keep their hair smoothed down and demure (Bandoline, is one), no doubt to help out the natural process. I remember reading an experiment in a newspaper a few years back where some women tried not washing their hair for a few weeks. Some gave up at once but those who persevered agreed that it did somehow smooth down and seem less awful. But they all hated it.
The thing we forget is just how badly people would have smelled! Even in early CS days.

Re periods: one reason Tampax wasn't used by 'nice' girls was that theoretically you can't use a tampon if you're a virgin. You can see Matey & Co being appalled by a girl who used them! (I remember those vile thick pads with loops and horrible belts and the embarassment of having to dispose of them if you were staying at someone's house :oops: )

Author:  MJKB [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

sealpuppy wrote:
The thing we forget is just how badly people would have smelled! Even in early CS days.

But the CS puts great emphasis on cleanliness. The girls bath every day as do the girls from the EB schools and the Kingscote girls. Maybe all three authors were rather unrealistic about washing and bathing facilities in the schools of their day.
sealpuppy wrote:
Re periods: one reason Tampax wasn't used by 'nice' girls was that theoretically you can't use a tampon if you're a virgin. You can see Matey & Co being appalled by a girl who used them! (I remember those vile thick pads with loops and horrible belts and the embarassment of having to dispose of them if you were staying at someone's house :oops: )

Archbishop McQuaid, AB of Dublin in the period between the 50's and the 70's attempted to have tampons banned! He implied that it was a grevious sin to use them, especially if one were unmarried!

Author:  Kathy_S [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I believe the wording used was that tampons interfered with/irritated parts that shouldn't be interfered with. Something like that. At any rate, they weren't to be thought of. :shock:

Author:  JB [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 11:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I bet Joan Baker used tampons. :wink:

Author:  Alison H [ Thu Jan 14, 2010 11:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Maybe that's why Matron was constantly rooting through people's drawers. She can't've been that bothered about how tidily people'd put their socks away, surely, so she must've been looking for something ...

Author:  Margaret [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Quote:
Slightly OT, but I always wondered how they dealt with periods/explaining the facts of life at CS, since as far as I can remember, such things are never mentioned. But I guess in EBD's day they wouldn't be mentioned in polite society anyway.


I'm fairly certain they simply wouldn't have been mentioned. No talk from doctor, (he was a man!!!) nor matron, and many is the story of poor girls being totally shocked on their wedding night.

Author:  judithR [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

sealpuppy wrote:
Re periods: one reason Tampax wasn't used by 'nice' girls was that theoretically you can't use a tampon if you're a virgin. You can see Matey & Co being appalled by a girl who used them!)


This is what I tactfully trying not to say!

Author:  Mel [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

They were so crazy on health that they might have had talks from someone at the San and perhaps in the sixth form a nurse might have explained the facts of life.

Author:  cestina [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

The facts of life were delivered to us by the same sadistic matron who ran the san we were so anxious not be to sent to when ill.....you can imagine a)how she delivered them b) how we received them :(

Author:  Tor [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Quote:
I bet Joan Baker used tampons. :wink:


:lol: :lol: Definitely! Perhaps that was what Richenda (or was it Ruey...? Or possibly both!) was actually wrinkling her nose up at.

Regarding hair-care, I am reading (the absolutely brilliant, by the way) Miss Ranskill Comes Home by Barbara Euphan Todd, and there is a reference to 'polishing' the hair of children with a slik cloth. I liked that idea!

Author:  Llywela [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I went to a very large, rather run-down, bog-standard inner-city comprehensive in the late 80s-90s. As I recall, all the first year girls were gathered together into the hall for a talk on sanitary matters delivered by one of the PE teachers. My dominant memory of that talk was that it left me absolutely convinced that she was being paid a commission by the tampon company, so heavily did she advertise them, while dismissing pads/towels with absolute contempt. I remember feeling really annoyed that she was advocating the one so strongly at the expense of the other, rather than remaining objective.

As far as hair care goes, we've started to swing a little the other way again, after becoming so obsessed with washing our hair every day - one of the girls in my office tries to only do hers two or three times a week, as she colours her hair and finds that it fades faster the more often she washes, and my mother says the same thing.

Also...my mother tells the tale of a girl she went to school with who had very long hair, well below her waist. This girl washed her hair with washing up liquid - and yet managed to have perfect glossy hair, as my mother tells it. She also used to iron it - makes me glad for my straightening irons!

Author:  Thursday Next [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 1:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Llywela wrote:
As far as hair care goes, we've started to swing a little the other way again, after becoming so obsessed with washing our hair every day - one of the girls in my office tries to only do hers two or three times a week, as she colours her hair and finds that it fades faster the more often she washes, and my mother says the same thing.



I went to a different hairdressers for my colour last time and when she had finished she asked me not to wash it for at least two days and preferably three day to allow the new colours to develop properly before the first wash. It is the first time a hairdresser has said this to me although I usually only do my hair every two days and sometimes three days anyway. I used to do it every day but more recently I have found it doesn't get so dry if I don't wash it every day.

Author:  sealpuppy [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 3:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

judithR wrote:
sealpuppy wrote:
Re periods: one reason Tampax wasn't used by 'nice' girls was that theoretically you can't use a tampon if you're a virgin. You can see Matey & Co being appalled by a girl who used them!)


This is what I tactfully trying not to say!


Oops; sorry, I learnt tact at the Joey Maynard school!

Re people smelling, it wouldn't just be the smell of unwashed hair (or the whiff from the dry shampoo).Those velveteen frocks would probably only have been dry-cleaned in the holidays, wouldn't they? They sewed in clean washable collar and cuffs but the dress wouldn't be washable. (There's a Germaine Greer about the British attitude to dry cleaning, but it's not polite so I shall try to be a laydee!)

Author:  Joey [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 4:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Plus, they may have had daily baths, but deodorant was practically non-existant, at least in the early years. Which probably wouldn't have mattered much in Winter (because of those same baths) but probably would have mattered in Summer. Actually, scrap that - there's all that healthy gym and country dancing in the Winter, so it would have matterd then too.

Author:  Llywela [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 4:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Joey wrote:
Plus, they may have had daily baths, but deodorant was practically non-existant, at least in the early years. Which probably wouldn't have mattered much in Winter (because of those same baths) but probably would have mattered in Summer. Actually, scrap that - there's all that healthy gym and country dancing in the Winter, so it would have matterd then too.

That's true - although I remember reading one of Ruth Rendell's stories (one that she had written under a different name, though) and the bulk of it was set back in the 40s-50s - a large part of the story was a woman remembering her youth during the war years and thereafter, when she would go to stay with her aunts in the country during school holidays. And one of the things she remembers is the more worldly aunt having deodorant, but having to stand with her arms in the air for half an hour after applying it, so that it could dry!

Matey and the strict hours at the Chalet School would never stand for any of that!

Author:  delrima [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

But didn't one use talcum powder under the arms at least to - well not deodorize, but to scent the sweat (so to speak!). At least my Mum and Gran certainly used the stuff. Lily of the Valley was the favoured flavour, if I recall. And who could forget.

Author:  Cosimo's Jackal [ Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

delrima wrote:
But didn't one use talcum powder under the arms at least to - well not deodorize, but to scent the sweat (so to speak!). At least my Mum and Gran certainly used the stuff. Lily of the Valley was the favoured flavour, if I recall. And who could forget.


And I believe one sewed in things called 'dress preservers' into the armpits of dresses?

Author:  andydaly [ Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

One thing I hadn't considered was that during the forties and early fifties, rationing meant a lack of soap and shampoo, so women washed their hair once a week or less and fuel rationing meant that only a small amount of heated water was permitted for bathing. This was mentioned in the website linked in JB's thread "How they really looked" which is really excellent! I know that rationing wouldn't have applied in Switzerland, but the habits developed during the austerity years probably stuck in people's heads, and during the forties and fifties I would think, would probably be so much a part of EBD's everyday life that they may have seeped into the books? Is this the possible reason for the cold baths and and infrequent hair washing?

ETA - corrected typos

Author:  cestina [ Sun Jan 17, 2010 11:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I think the infrequent hair washing was linked to the idea that it was unhealthy to wash your hair too often, rather than for reasons of economy.

But it's certainly true that soap and water were in short supply during the war years. There is a lovely scene in an early information film about the Citizens Advice Bureau Service (which started on the day war broke out in Sept 1939) showing two women consulting the CAB about how to get enough soap flakes to do the weekly wash. "Aha" says the adviser with enthusiasm "you could join together to do the wash - one of you supplying the hot water, the other the soap, turn and turn about each week. And it would be such fun to do it together wouldn't it?" Jolly laughter from all.........

Author:  topcat [ Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Slightly off track here. While researching prior to writing a school history I interviewed several girls who had been at said school in the 20s and 30s and they told me about 'dandriff games' - everyone bent their head forwards over the dark blue of their uniform and then shook their hair to see who won with the most dandruff!

The 20s and 30s were definitely times when hair washing and clothes washing was not that frequent - but yes there were dress protectors.

Author:  rugbyliz [ Fri Jan 22, 2010 11:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I was at a boarding school in the early 1980s and when I was in the junior house (girls aged 8-12) we were only allowed to wash our hair once a week and bath three times a week...................

Author:  fraujackson [ Fri Jan 22, 2010 3:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

rugbyliz wrote:
I was at a boarding school in the early 1980s and when I was in the junior house (girls aged 8-12) we were only allowed to wash our hair once a week and bath three times a week...................


Same for us. But this seemed quite normal and reasonable- I remember getting quite aggravated when my mother decreed bath-and-hair-every-day when I was about eleven. I had so many better things to do than have my appearance messed about with !

(I do wash every day *now* :oops: )

Author:  Llywela [ Mon Feb 01, 2010 11:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

You know what's really struck me, as a result of this discussion? I am reminded of all those stories I've ever read wherein girls were encouraged to brush their hair at least a hundred times every night, to make it shine. I never really saw the point - as someone who grew up in an age of regular hair washing, I've never known brushing to be something that added shine to hair. And it had never occurred to m e before to read apply the context of irregular hair washing to those lines, to realise that if the hair hadn't been washed in a couple of weeks, a really good, hard brushing really would make a difference.

Context is everything!

Author:  MJKB [ Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

The impression given in the books is that every one glowed with good health, looks and cleanliness. Perhaps teenage girls can get away without deodorants and other smellies if they have cold baths every morning? Most schools at the time would not have advocated such frequent bathing. We were allocated one bath and hairwash a week when I was a Junior in the middle-late 60's. I do remember the older girls with chronically greasy hair and spots. I should if they had brush their hair as per Matron's instructions they could have supplied many a chipper with frying grease!
I think I mentioned this before in another thread, but I wonder how frequently they changed underwear.

Author:  andi [ Mon Feb 01, 2010 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

MJKB wrote:
Perhaps teenage girls can get away without deodorants and other smellies if they have cold baths every morning?


There was a programme on UK TV a few years ago where a group of teenagers spent about 6 weeks in a school run as they were in (I think) the 1930s i.e only one bath per week etc. It took place over a fairly warm summer and I remember one of the girls commenting after a few weeks on how everyone smelt!

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

MJKB wrote:
We were allocated one bath and hairwash a week when I was a Junior in the middle-late 60's. I do remember the older girls with chronically greasy hair and spots. I should if they had brush their hair as per Matron's instructions they could have supplied many a chipper with frying grease!
I think I mentioned this before in another thread, but I wonder how frequently they changed underwear.


Now we, in the mid-to-late 60s, always had 3 baths a week - only one of which could be at bed-time, though; the others happened during prep or (again only one) first thing in the morning, before breakfast. You only got 30 minutes for the whole thing, though, from excusing yourself to the prefect on prep duty to returning to your studies, clean and refreshed! And yes, we did use bubble bath - it wasn't, of course, provided but you were allowed to bring your own, and little sachets of that or bath salts (the fore-runners to today's bath bombs) made popular Christmas presents. Showers, though, were unknown; and in the boarding-house I was in, the basins were not cubicled, and the culture in that house and at that time was to be very body-shy, you dressed and undressed under your nightie, so washing other than at bath-times didn't happen. In other boarding-houses, they had bedroom cubicles with their own wash-basins, so could wash themselves daily "from nose-tip to tail-tip" if they felt so inclined.

I think we changed our underwear 2-3 times a week; more often if we washed it ourselves (again, this was permissible) rather than sending it to the school laundry. We usually had 2 clean blouses a week, too.

Author:  cestina [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

We had double underpants - white underneath and dark green on top, at least in the winter months. I seem to remember that we changed the white ones every other day.....

We also had several vests and/or liberty bodices so we must have changed those fairly regularly as well.....

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cestina wrote:
We had double underpants - white underneath and dark green on top, at least in the winter months.


We did at primary school, but in practice, at secondary school, you only wore the brown outer layer for gym, coupled with a white Aertex blouse. They were removed at the end of the lesson! And given that this was the 1960s, our underwear was mostly nasty nylon, which was thought the height of modernity at the time! Cotton underpants were only for old ladies - probably the kind who still wore directoire knickers!

Incidentally, I was amazed when reading Jean of Storms that Kirsty wears hand-knitted underpants - that must have been horrendously scratchy! I know Jean and Oona are horrified by the poverty of her underthings, but even still....

Author:  emma t [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Llywela wrote:
You know what's really struck me, as a result of this discussion? I am reminded of all those stories I've ever read wherein girls were encouraged to brush their hair at least a hundred times every night, to make it shine. I never really saw the point - as someone who grew up in an age of regular hair washing, I've never known brushing to be something that added shine to hair.


If they were not washing hair all the time, and brushing it lots, surely this would make it look greasy? I know if I have not been able to wash hair when I am ill, it goes greasy with brushing, or maybe that's just me!

As a carer, I find that alot of older people do not like washing, going into the shower and or bath. They have to be encouraged, I suppose this is because they were probably used to only washing hair so many times, and bathing infront of fires, etc when growing up.

Author:  Nightwing [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

emma t wrote:
Llywela wrote:
You know what's really struck me, as a result of this discussion? I am reminded of all those stories I've ever read wherein girls were encouraged to brush their hair at least a hundred times every night, to make it shine. I never really saw the point - as someone who grew up in an age of regular hair washing, I've never known brushing to be something that added shine to hair.


If they were not washing hair all the time, and brushing it lots, surely this would make it look greasy? I know if I have not been able to wash hair when I am ill, it goes greasy with brushing, or maybe that's just me!


In one of the Little House books Ma tells Laura to brush her hair 100 times a night because it's getting very dry - so perhaps that has something to do with it!

Author:  mohini [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

According to me, the CS girls washed thier hair once a week. The whole lot of them and then they sat to dry thier hair in sun on the meadow. I picture all the girls with hair loose behind them, red black blonde, brunette white, short long someone's reaching below knee,and vapour coming out of the hair as it dries.
Maybe flames will come form red hair.

Author:  Joey [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

That's a lovely picture, Mohini. Thank you.

Author:  Margaret [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Mrs Redboots wrote:
We did at primary school, but in practice, at secondary school, you only wore the brown outer layer for gym, coupled with a white Aertex blouse. They were removed at the end of the lesson! And given that this was the 1960s, our underwear was mostly nasty nylon, which was thought the height of modernity at the time! Cotton underpants were only for old ladies - probably the kind who still wore directoire knickers!

Incidentally, I was amazed when reading Jean of Storms that Kirsty wears hand-knitted underpants - that must have been horrendously scratchy! I know Jean and Oona are horrified by the poverty of her underthings, but even still....


My SLOC tells horror stories of wearing woolen underwear at public school in early 1960s, then being taken out for the day by parents and ending the outing in the theatre, where it was really warm. That has to take the biscuit for itch-value.

Author:  fraujackson [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 4:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cestina wrote:
We had double underpants - white underneath and dark green on top, at least in the winter months. I seem to remember that we changed the white ones every other day.....


We had two pairs as well, except they were both blue, and one pair was 'normal' and one was what we called Hippo Knickers with a pocket in the leg. You had to keep your inhaler (if you had one) in your knicker leg pocket, so when you ran you rattled. There was a rule about not keeping sweets in your knicker leg pocket, I remember :)

Back to the right/left-handed thread: the knickers were right-handed. (I mean, the pocket was on the right hand side. Lefties like me used to go through a strange cross-body writhing movement whenever we wanted to fish anything out.)

Author:  MJKB [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I've always been fascinated by idea of wearing such bulky underthings. Wear they worn in summer too? If they were they must have made the more ample girls looked positively elephant like.
Our inventory at boarding school in the mid 60's specified three/fourpairs of knickers per week! It wasn't so bad for me as I was only nine at the time, but for the older girls......My older sisters kept sending home for more and more pants til they had amassed 14 each. One of them started a trend for washing out nylons and pants at night and leaving them to dry on the radiators. That was soon stopped by the head of the dormitory, Mother Dorothy (Dotty). She complained to the Mother of Studies, Mother Borgia, that the girls had turned the dormitory into a Chinese Laundry. Heads rolled.

Author:  Shander [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I'll admit that the pocket in the knicker leg thing has always confused me. It makes sense in a way if that's all you're wearing, but how do you get to it if you're wearing a dress? Is there a slit in the dress that you put hand into, or do you have to fish under your skirt in order to get into the pocket, or indeed into the knicker leg, where I've always been told people also kept things.
Also, is it uncomfortable wearing two sets of underwear? I have to echo MJKB in saying that it sounds rather bulky.

Author:  Margaret [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Shander wrote:
I'll admit that the pocket in the knicker leg thing has always confused me. It makes sense in a way if that's all you're wearing, but how do you get to it if you're wearing a dress? Is there a slit in the dress that you put hand into, or do you have to fish under your skirt in order to get into the pocket, or indeed into the knicker leg, where I've always been told people also kept things.
Also, is it uncomfortable wearing two sets of underwear? I have to echo MJKB in saying that it sounds rather bulky.


The pocket was right down by the knee, which was where the knickers came to, and you lifted your skirt (which also came to the knee) up just a little to get what was in it. There is a picture on the front of my copy of Princess, illustrated by NKB with Joey wearing just those knickers. Bulky? Yes, our underwear was, but one gets used to anything, really, and with two pairs of knickers, no worse than pants and jeans. Also the outer garments weren't designed to be figure hugging, they were cut to allow room for vest, liberty bodice, petticoat and two pairs of knickers.

Author:  Artemis [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

With no deodorants, unwashed hair, all those clothes, and the summer heat, the smell in the classrooms must have been indescribable in the summer . . .

Author:  Catherine [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I've just been re-reading Three Go (p.141 GGBP version) and found this info:

Quote:
All the Juniors went to bed at eight and lights-out for them came at a quarter to nine to allow bath people to be back in their cubicles before that .... it meant a pretty tight squeeze to see that every girl got at least two hot baths a week, and the lists for the Juniors were three deep every night.


I've no idea what the situation was in Switzerland but I found this information quite interesting as in the Swiss books I always got the impression that there was only enough time to get undressed, say prayers and brush teeth etc. before Lights Out. I might have got that wrong of course!

Author:  Alison H [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Didn't someone - I think it was Lavender Leigh - cause mayhem by lettign the bath overflow once? That suggests that in the British years the girls could have baths in the evenings and got plenty of time for them, but there certainly doesn't seem to be much time in Switzerland. Maybe if it was your "bath night" you just missed dancing in the evening.

Author:  cal562301 [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Artemis wrote:
With no deodorants, unwashed hair, all those clothes, and the summer heat, the smell in the classrooms must have been indescribable in the summer . . .


I can imagine. One of my strongest memories of my years in Spain is travelling on the Madrid underground in August during the rush hour. The smell of stale sweat and garlic was overpowering! :roll: :lol:

Author:  MJKB [ Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Catherine wrote:
Quote:
All the Juniors went to bed at eight and lights-out for them came at a quarter to nine to allow bath people to be back in their cubicles before that .... it meant a pretty tight squeeze to see that every girl got at least two hot baths a week, and the lists for the Juniors were three deep every night.


I wonder did they skip the cold morning bath if they'd had a hot bath the previous night? That would have eased congestion in the morning.
Artemis wrote:
With no deodorants, unwashed hair, all those clothes, and the summer heat, the smell in the classrooms must have been indescribable in the summer . . .
With no deodorants, unwashed hair, all those clothes, and the summer heat, the smell in the classrooms must have been indescribable in the summer . . .
The cold morning bath would have closed the pores and therefore cut back on the perspiration. And children and teenagers tend not to smell unless they're really unwashed.
Nowadays we probably wash too much. I bath or shower at night, wash my hair nightly and still have a dip in the morning. In my childhood most people I knew bathed once a week and washed daily. I honestly don't remember people with those habits smelling too badly, or at all, in fact. I do, however, remember rather strong smells coming from locals at Sunday Mass in the country. I rather doubt that too many indulged in a weekly bath or hair wash. Up to the early 1970's there was quite a large minority who did not have bathrooms in some county places.

Author:  Artemis [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Quote:
The cold morning bath would have closed the pores and therefore cut back on the perspiration. And children and teenagers tend not to smell unless they're really unwashed.


Every year I have to give my Year 6 kids a piece of work tactfully designed to explain the need for personal hygiene, usually because either I can't stand the smell or some of them have complained about the smell of stale sweat emanating from some of the others - and it's not just the boys: last year the worst offender was a girl . . . Their faces and hands are clean, but they don't appear to wash under their arms. A lot of them need to use a deodorant well before they do but it varies from child to child: my older daughter did not need to use one until she was eleven/twelve; my younger daughter needed to use one by the time she was ten.

Spending an entire day in a classroom with it is really unpleasant.

Author:  MJKB [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 3:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Artemis wrote:
Every year I have to give my Year 6 kids a piece of work tactfully designed to explain the need for personal hygiene, usually because either I can't stand the smell or some of them have complained about the smell of stale sweat emanating from some of the others -
But have we not become far too conscious of normal body odour? My fifteen year old showers every second day and uses a mild deodorant. I've never got a smell from her.

Author:  Mrs Redboots [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Going back to the hair-washing topic, I went to an Old Girls' reception for my old school the other day (yes, I know it was sad!) and saw people I hadn't seen for 40 years or more; it was interesting that most of the hair that had been frizzy and apt to explode at the slightest provocation is now far more under control. I dare say this is largely due to modern conditioners, although one woman did say hers had continued frizzy until she got pregnant, and as soon as she was, it went limp and has stayed that way ever since.

Author:  Kate [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

MJKB wrote:
Artemis wrote:
Every year I have to give my Year 6 kids a piece of work tactfully designed to explain the need for personal hygiene, usually because either I can't stand the smell or some of them have complained about the smell of stale sweat emanating from some of the others -
But have we not become far too conscious of normal body odour? My fifteen year old showers every second day and uses a mild deodorant. I've never got a smell from her.

I don't think it's just that. There are some days I walk into fifth and sixth class in our school and immediately have to open all the windows.

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

It was a long running joke in Sixth Form that for one lesson a week (Language with a certain teacher) we had to venture out of the largely Sixth only building to a room used by pupils in all years on site (9-13) and you could always tell when the Year 9s had been in the period before because the first thing you did was open all the windows...

My brother is that age now, and we all thought that his room smelt as bad as it did because of the fish until they got moved to the pond outside :lol: Teenagers, boys especially, have a scent all of their own!

Author:  Tor [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Hormones have a lot to do with it, both production-wise and sensitivity to the smell too. I had an office mate who, I swear, I could pinpoint where she was in her cycle by how she smelt. She was fastidiously clean (I think she was aware she was a little pungent at times), and would wash and re-apply deodorant at work, but her scent would just come through. I could even tell when she became pregnant by the shift in smells. :shock: :shock: :shock:

I have a fairly sensitive nose, but this was like having witch-smelling powers!!! She was at her most pungent just before the time of the month - I can only assume that she was the end-point of the normal range of variation in prodcution of olfactory cues about our reproductive status, and I was just sensitive to the smells (but not enamoured by them...!)

My vague point being that people can smell, even if they are clean, but that smell might go unnoticed if you (i) aren't able to smell it or (ii) it smells quite normal to you. Either of these things are more likely if you spend all you time together (e.g. at school) or are related to each other (you may have similar smells). It's a bit like going to someones home and realising it smells - I usually find I am friends with people whose homes don't 'smell' in my opinion; I suspect we all actually smell the same, rather than us being the non-smelly people to the rest of the worlds smelliness, if that makes sense.

I'm not suprised if a room full of pre- or pubescent kids was a little high - all those hormones whizzing!

Author:  Alison H [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 5:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I suppose if you're used to a "level" of smell that it doesn't seem strange to you. In medieval and early modern times, when most people in Britain and Europe rarely bathed at all - Richard II was considered to be rather weird because he was keen on washing, and even by late Tudor times Elizabeth I was considered to be obsessed with bathing because she liked to have a bath once a month - and the rushes on the floors were only changed a few times a year, everywhere and everyone must have absolutely reeked :shock: , but people must just have been used to it and not thought anything of it.

I know what you mean, Tor! For example, I don't like going into the house or even the car of someone who owns a dog (apologies to all dog-owners!) because I find the smell of dog very strong and I don't like it, but I assume that dog owners don't mind that smell at all. I even find it a bit odd going into the homes of people who like a lot of spicy food, because the cooking smells tend to hang around, but again I'm sure it smells fine to the people who live there and it's just me being over-sensitive :lol: . I'm sure some people think my house smells of all sorts (er, although hopefully not ...).

Author:  Jenefer [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 5:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

The teachers at my school would come into a classroom and say that "we need some fresh air in here" before making us open the windows

Author:  Lesley [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Isn't it supposed to be that the problem with teenage boys' odour disappears almost as soon as they discover girls? :wink:

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Hasn't worked then! A couple of months ago my brother ruined a pair of new shoes scribbling over them the name of a girl who dumped him a few days later. He still smells! (I mean that in the nicest possible way, but he won't bathe until you force him into it. Teenage boys. Ugh.)

Certainly I never noticed it among my own age group, so I do think that it's the familiarity of a smell rather than its strength that makes the difference. You've made me realise that my best friend's house smells very similar to my grandad's, but I notice it far more at my best friend's.

Author:  Lesley [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

I mean that when they discover girls they realise that to attract them, they have to smell better! :lol: Perhaps your brother will start having more baths when he realises he's more likely to keep the girl if he smells good! :wink:

Author:  cal562301 [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Living in an international community, I have noticed a difference in smells, if I may put it like that. :roll:

My Korean (and other Asian) friends seem to have a strong spicy smell, which they apparently are unaware of. On the other hand, I know that when I get really sweaty and can smell my own odour (yuk!), it has a much more sickly sweet smell.

Thankfully, it doesn't happen too often, usually when I have dried sweat on the neck of something.

But I think this is scientifically recognised, that we all have a scent or smell (how else would dogs, for instance, distinguish between us?). I guess it's just that we get used to our own scents, or those that are close to ours and only recognise those that are overwhelming or different.

I think I've mentioned elsewhere on this board, my unpleasant experience with smells of stale sweat and garlic on the Madrid underground in August!
Lesley wrote:
I mean that when they discover girls they realise that to attract them, they have to smell better! :lol: Perhaps your brother will start having more baths when he realises he's more likely to keep the girl if he smells good! :wink:


I have to admit that my own younger brothers' personal hygiene dramatically improved when they became seriously interested in girls!

Author:  JB [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cal562301 wrote:

Lesley wrote:
I mean that when they discover girls they realise that to attract them, they have to smell better! :lol: Perhaps your brother will start having more baths when he realises he's more likely to keep the girl if he smells good! :wink:


I have to admit that my own younger brothers' personal hygiene dramatically improved when they became seriously interested in girls!


Ariel - I think it's only a matter of time before you're telling us that, when you go home for the holidays, your brother is hogging the bathroom. :)

Author:  Catherine [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Alison H wrote:
I don't like going into the house or even the car of someone who owns a dog (apologies to all dog-owners!) because I find the smell of dog very strong and I don't like it, but I assume that dog owners don't mind that smell at all. I even find it a bit odd going into the homes of people who like a lot of spicy food, because the cooking smells tend to hang around, but again I'm sure it smells fine to the people who live there and it's just me being over-sensitive :lol:.



I completely agree with you, Alison! I'm not a dog owner nor really a dog fan so I really notice the smell. Same goes for spicy food. I suppose you don't notice it if you live with it - but then I cooked salmon twice last week and it's taken days to get rid of the smell of fish - and I had the extractor fan on and the window open!

I have a thing about people's breath too - especially if they've had a few cups of coffee/smell of stale alcohol/had something particularly smelly to eat the night before! At a meeting once, I sat beside someone who'd been out drinking the night before and I could barely concentrate for the smell! I'm always very conscious of my own breath and I'm always apologising if I think it's a bit smelly - but I've put that down to being a dentist's daughter!

One thing that always puzzles me is why people clean their teeth last thing at night and then again first thing in the morning - before they've had breakfast ... and presumably when they've eaten nothing since they last cleaned their teeth. But then I'm single so I don't have to worry about what my breath smells like first thing in the morning! All the same, I do wonder whether some of those dental visits for the CS girls might have been avoided if they'd brushed their teeth after their breakfast and not before!

Author:  ChubbyMonkey [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 7:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

That's always puzzled me as well! I do it after my breakfast - though before my cup of tea, so that it can take away the taste! I do love the image of Matey being told that she has to tell the girls to do it after Fruhstuck only to start tearing her hair out and demanding to know where in the routine they have room for that :lol:

Author:  MJKB [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cal562301 wrote:
Living in an international community, I have noticed a difference in smells, if I may put it like that. :roll:

The difference in smell became the excuse for some rather horrible racist comments in my school. Sadly, it didn't come just from the children, some of the teachers were worse.
My very best friend in Primary school was an Indian girl. She had five or six much older sisters who literally scrubbed her from top to toe everyday. Coming from a family where the children had one bath and hair wash a week, I couldn't get over the fact that when she arrived home from school she had to wash again and change underwear. Her house, however, reeked of spices which I found very off putting. My diet was very limited and bland at the time, so hot spicy food was not only exotic but unpleasant. I'm sure if I were lucky enough to partake of one of their authentic curries now when my palate is slightly more developed (all of their ingredients were sourced from India)I'd think I'd thorougly enjoy it.

Author:  Lyanne [ Mon Feb 08, 2010 12:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

MJKB wrote:
cal562301 wrote:
Living in an international community, I have noticed a difference in smells, if I may put it like that. :roll:

The difference in smell became the excuse for some rather horrible racist comments in my school. Sadly, it didn't come just from the children, some of the teachers were worse.
My very best friend in Primary school was an Indian girl. She had five or six much older sisters who literally scrubbed her from top to toe everyday. Coming from a family where the children had one bath and hair wash a week, I couldn't get over the fact that when she arrived home from school she had to wash again and change underwear. Her house, however, reeked of spices which I found very off putting. My diet was very limited and bland at the time, so hot spicy food was not only exotic but unpleasant. I'm sure if I were lucky enough to partake of one of their authentic curries now when my palate is slightly more developed (all of their ingredients were sourced from India)I'd think I'd thorougly enjoy it.


Working in a preschool with a 'diverse intake' (lots of people from different cultures!) I once had to give out to headlice slip and have a parent tell me 'It's all those (racial slur), they never wash.' I frostily replied that a) they are actually very clean but often clean hair without shampoo and water, and b) we knew who it was and it was a child of same background as herself. (Managed not to say, it's your child, you horrible woman!)

My mum washed my hair for ages. I had to have it cut before I could go on a week-long school trip aged 10 (now Year 6) as I'd never have been able to wash it on my own otherwise. In fact, this was when my scolisis was discovered as my grandma noticed my back wasn't straight once my hair was out of the way.

Author:  cal562301 [ Mon Feb 08, 2010 12:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

Lyanne wrote:
MJKB wrote:
cal562301 wrote:
Living in an international community, I have noticed a difference in smells, if I may put it like that. :roll:

The difference in smell became the excuse for some rather horrible racist comments in my school. Sadly, it didn't come just from the children, some of the teachers were worse.
My very best friend in Primary school was an Indian girl. She had five or six much older sisters who literally scrubbed her from top to toe everyday. Coming from a family where the children had one bath and hair wash a week, I couldn't get over the fact that when she arrived home from school she had to wash again and change underwear. Her house, however, reeked of spices which I found very off putting. My diet was very limited and bland at the time, so hot spicy food was not only exotic but unpleasant. I'm sure if I were lucky enough to partake of one of their authentic curries now when my palate is slightly more developed (all of their ingredients were sourced from India)I'd think I'd thorougly enjoy it.


Working in a preschool with a 'diverse intake' (lots of people from different cultures!) I once had to give out to headlice slip and have a parent tell me 'It's all those (racial slur), they never wash.' I frostily replied that a) they are actually very clean but often clean hair without shampoo and water, and b) we knew who it was and it was a child of same background as herself. (Managed not to say, it's your child, you horrible woman!)

My mum washed my hair for ages. I had to have it cut before I could go on a week-long school trip aged 10 (now Year 6) as I'd never have been able to wash it on my own otherwise. In fact, this was when my scolisis was discovered as my grandma noticed my back wasn't straight once my hair was out of the way.



I hope no one took my comment as racist, because it wasn't intended that way.

On the subject of head lice, I always understood that they actually prefer clean, well-kept hair to dirty hair, but no doubt someone will correct me if I'm wrong. :)

ChubbyMonkey wrote:
That's always puzzled me as well! I do it after my breakfast - though before my cup of tea, so that it can take away the taste! I do love the image of Matey being told that she has to tell the girls to do it after Fruhstuck only to start tearing her hair out and demanding to know where in the routine they have room for that :lol:


I read somewhere recently that the best advice is to brush your teeth at least an hour after your last meal. This is presumably why many people brush their teeth on getting up, as they wouldn't have time to wait an hour after breakfast before brushing them.

A couple of years ago, when I was going through a healthy eating stage, I ate more fruit than I do at present. During that time, I went for a check up with the dentist and he asked me whether I had been eating more fruit or drinking lots of sugary drinks. So, I told him about my 'healthy' eating. His advice to me then was to wait at least an hour after eating fruit before brushing my teeth. Acid from the fruit damages the enamel, which is how he could tell, and apparently brushing them too soon actually makes the problem worse.

So an apple a day may keep the doctor away, but it may also bring the dentist closer! :lol:

Edited once to correct typo.

Author:  Nightwing [ Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cal562301 wrote:
So an apple a day may keep the doctor away, but it may also bring the dentist closer! :lol:


And flossing apparently can reduce the risk of heart problems :D

Author:  RroseSelavy [ Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

cal562301 wrote:
I hope no one took my comment as racist, because it wasn't intended that way.


Not at all - I've heard many south-east Asians say that to them, Europeans can smell of sour milk, so there's evidently a general you-smell-of-what-you-eat pattern around the world!

Author:  julieanne1811 [ Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

ChubbyMonkey wrote:
That's always puzzled me as well! I do it after my breakfast - though before my cup of tea, so that it can take away the taste!

The theory is that you should brush your teeth before breakfast in order to rid your mouth of the bacteria that cause decay before you eat. Brushing after breakfast means that the bacteria are already very active because of the sugar (not necessarily sucrose), and also the teeth are 'softer' because of theacid and so on produced by the bacteria. Brushing before breakfast apparently reduces this.

Author:  julieanne1811 [ Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

And, having just washed my hair has made me think of something else. Doesn't someone say somewhere that after hair was washed it became too soft and silky to do anything with. And I read on a post somewhere or other that someone had tried to put their hair into 'ear-phones', but wasn't able to do it because although their hair was down to their waist, it wouldn't stay.
So do you think that they were more used to having the 'slightly oily' hair (in the Great Hair-Washing Punishment), and that this helped them to make the interesting hair styles they preferred?
Sorry - have just found out that I have spreeded ... won't do it again!
And, funnily enough, I [i]do [i] know three German words - mit, bahnhof, rahm ... and I have used all three in context!!!!

Author:  Nicci [ Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

"On the subject of head lice, I always understood that they actually prefer clean, well-kept hair to dirty hair, but no doubt someone will correct me if I'm wrong"

lice have no preference at all on the cleanliness of hair. There is some research to suggest that they aren't keen in tea tree oil, however, so anyone who suffers from lice (or has children who do) could always try a tea tree based shampoo and see if that helped.

Some children do seem more prone to lice than others though, and I'm not sure what causes this.

Sorry for dodgy quoting technique, but my iPhone doesn't seem to like taking quotes from long posts :?

Author:  Miss Di [ Mon Mar 01, 2010 4:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hair Washing at the Chalet School

julieanne1811 wrote:
So do you think that they were more used to having the 'slightly oily' hair (in the Great Hair-Washing Punishment), and that this helped them to make the interesting hair styles they preferred?


Absolutely. If you ever get your hair "done" - for a wedding, formal, ball or such - your hairdresser should tell you not to wash your hair that day as squeaky clean hair is too hard to style.

Similarly in Zadie Smith's White Teeth a character suffers bad burns to her head when having her hair chemically straightened because no one remembered to tell her she needed the natural oils of not freshly washed hair to protect her from the chemicals.

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