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#1: Annoying phrases/words Author: Clare, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:32 pm
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Inspired by the 'Most Irritating EBDism' and my own re-reading of Challenge... Are there any repeated or overused phrases/words which irritate you?

I'm sick of the word 'poppet' in the first couple of chapters of Challenge!

I also don't particularly like 'brats' in Joey Goes, because it's used all the time.

#2: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:39 pm
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Eyes that had never yet needed glasses is very annoying - why did EBD think this was something worthy of note? Rolling Eyes

#3: Author: dorian, Location: Dublin

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:45 pm
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"Moke" turning up every second page in Three Go - I get the definite impression that EBD had just learned a new word and loved it not wisely but too well. Smile

#4: Author: Lisa A., Location: North Yorkshire

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:02 pm
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I don't like it when someone makes a perfectly reasonable suggestion to someone else and the second someone flashes back with "don't be an ass!" or "talk sense!"

#5: Author: Chelsea, Location: Your Imagination

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:30 pm
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I don't like "True for you" - used when whatever the the first person said is true for everyone!

#6: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:33 pm
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I'm not keen on "my lamb" being used all the time.

#7: Re: Annoying phrases/words Author: Pat, Location: Doncaster

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:44 pm
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Clare wrote:

Inspired by the 'Most Irritating EBDism' and my own re-reading of Challenge... Are there any repeated or overused phrases/words which irritate you?

I'm sick of the word 'poppet' in the first couple of chapters of Challenge!

Poppet is used in a lot of other books too. A mistress (any of them!!) is a poppet unless you get on the wrong side of her!

#8: Author: Pado, Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:50 pm
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...still, white, and to all appearances, dead...

#9: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:58 pm
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"Faithful handmaiden" - grrr!!

"Baby" when used to describe someone aged 6.

Over-use of the words "pretty" and "little". I know we all have favourite adjectives which we over-use, but there are limits!

#10: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:08 pm
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Miss Annersley to a member of staff: "My dear girl!"

#11: Re: Annoying phrases/words Author: JoS, Location: South Africa

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:10 pm
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Clare wrote:

I also don't particularly like 'brats' in Joey Goes, because it's used all the time.

Agreed. The constant use of the word spoilt the entire book for me.

#12: Author: francesn, Location: away with the faeries

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:42 pm
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She does seem to seize upon a particular word, use it do DEATH in one book and then never use it again.

#13: Author: Lottie, Location: Humphrey's Corner

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:04 pm
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francesn wrote:

She does seem to seize upon a particular word, use it do DEATH in one book and then never use it again.

I'm sure that Miss Annersley tells the girls that repetition is bad, and unnecessary. Perhaps EBD didn't listen to what Miss Annersley said! Rolling Eyes

#14: Author: Róisín, Location: Ireland

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:22 pm
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Eyes like pansies... eyes like pansies ... eyes like pansies .... ad infinitum.

Edit: I'm amazed the pansyeyed girls didn't all turn out to be related through a strange twist of fate Rolling Eyes

#15: Author: Kathy_S, Location: midwestern US

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:32 pm
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I've never been certain what eyes like pansies are. It's not as though they come in a particular color.
*tries to imagine yellow eyes with purple spots*

Maybe they're supposed to look "soft"?

#16: Author: Róisín, Location: Ireland

Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:36 pm
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I always thought pansy-eyes were violetty. But then Gillian Lintons are blue. Maybe they were a velvetty-blue and therefore violetty in a certain light. Confused

Frankly, purple eyes (a la Viola Lucy) would scare me if I ever saw someone with them (and they weren't decorative contact lenses). And I always found it very disconcerting that Vi Lucy's name was Viol(a) and she is always described as having Viol(et) eyes. It was like EBD was trying to write a limerick or something.

#17: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 4:20 am
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Or "eyes like grey wood violets". There's both pansy blue and pansy brown, which is a bit disconcerting, as I don't think I've seen brown pansies.

The repeated use of the word "hanes" by Joey, years after leaving Wales.

"Shining light of"

"Featherbeds of whipped cream"

"Typically French looking"

The use of "brats" in Joey goes to the Oberland is particularly grating, as it's not used with any great frequency before or after the book, and the modern meaning of brat, in any case, is highly uncomplimentary.

"They're naughty, but it's a nice naughty" and similar phrases - code for "they're bad now, but in a few years will be responsible leaders in the school".

#18: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:46 am
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I think somewhere eyes are mentioned as being 'soft as pansies' so I assumed that, rather than colour, she meant a velvety look - usually used when someone is being sympathetic I think.

#19: Author: lizarfau, Location: Melbourne

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:14 am
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"The outside of enough." I hate that.

#20: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:40 am
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Hmmm. The only ones I can think of that actually annoy me are brats and moke, which are words EBD overuses in a particular book and then doesn't much use again.

The rest of the things everyone is mentionning are just exactly the things I like about the CS - a familiar, comforting writing style which makes me feel warm and included. They are like the daft family phrases and jokes we all have which don't mean anything to anyone else. I don't feel she overuses any of them particularly, and I smile whenever they crop up.

#21: Author: Elbee, Location: Surrey

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:59 am
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Gosh Caroline, you've summed it up for me exactly Shocked

Those are the only two words which annoy me too, and everything else is so comforting and familiar!

#22: Author: Rosie, Location: Land of Three-Quarters Sky

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:30 am
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"Flicks" in Mystery. It's like EBD was trying to be all hip... Surely it can't have been used QUITE so often at that period?

#23: Author: Katherine, Location: London, UK

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:35 am
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Yep, brats, moke and flicks all annoy me. It’s really when she picks one ‘non-standard’ word and then uses it to death throughout a book that I get annoyed.
The other thing that bugs is me in how in seemingly every Christmas play they finish up with the old ‘Chalet School favourite Adeste Fideles'. Having said that, have no idea what it sounds like, anyone know it and want to sing it at the gather? (preferably in a Joey-esque golden voice!)

#24: Author: Lexi, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:45 am
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Isn't it just O Come All Ye Faithful but in Latin?

#25: Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:48 am
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Katherine wrote:

The other thing that bugs is me in how in seemingly every Christmas play they finish up with the old ‘Chalet School favourite Adeste Fideles'. Having said that, have no idea what it sounds like, anyone know it and want to sing it at the gather? (preferably in a Joey-esque golden voice!)

I believe that Adeste Fideles is (or uses the same tune as) O Come All Ye Faithful.

The one that *really* annoys me is a word that's only used once in the entire series. I can live with the repeated words or phrases; I don't mind the brats and mokes (which does seem to be Clem's verbal tic - I'm sure she uses it in subsequent books). No; what bugs the *HECK* out of me is in The CS In the Oberland, where Peggy describes someone as being a mean "hunk".

I don't know the entemology of the word hunk, but all the dictionary definitions I've ever seen for the word suggest that it doesn't have a derogatory meaning to it so as an insult, it's limited at best and ludicrous at worst.

Ray *you use this word; I do not think you know what it means*

#26: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:51 am
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Lexi wrote:

Isn't it just O Come All Ye Faithful but in Latin?

Yup. I love that song. Smile

#27: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:38 pm
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Ray wrote:

in The CS In the Oberland, where Peggy describes someone as being a mean "hunk".

I don't have the book to hand, but I remember it as being 'a mean hunks', rather than 'hunk', in which case according to dictionary.com it means 1. a crabbed, disagreeable person; 2. a covetous, stingy person; miser.

#28: Author: Ray, Location: Bristol, England

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:48 pm
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LizB wrote:

Ray wrote:

in The CS In the Oberland, where Peggy describes someone as being a mean "hunk".

You could be right, but neither of those definitions exactly fits the gentleman (and I use the term loosely!) in question - I'd have thought cad would have been a far better term!

Ray *may need to look the sentence up*

#29: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 1:05 pm
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True *also may need to look this up*

Using the word 'mean' in front makes it tautologous as well - maybe Peggy didn't have a very good English teacher Wink

#30: Author: Lolly, Location: Melbourne

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:25 pm
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'Glorianna' as an expression - it just doesn't sound like anything anyone would ever have said. And they all say it all the time in at least two books

#31: Author: Elle, Location: Peterborough

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:12 pm
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"That's where you toes turn in." I think OOALML says it and it irritates the hell out of me!

Also 'hanes'

Grrrr.

#32: Author: dorian, Location: Dublin

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:43 pm
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Lexi wrote:

Isn't it just O Come All Ye Faithful but in Latin?

Yes. And it has an absolutely gorgeous descant, which no doubt Joey sang.

#33: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:45 pm
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dorian wrote:

Lexi wrote:

Isn't it just O Come All Ye Faithful but in Latin?

Yes. And it has an absolutely gorgeous descant, which no doubt Joey sang.

I know a beautiful descant to the English version, I wonder if it's the same one.

#34: Author: Katherine, Location: London, UK

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 8:42 am
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Ah, fideles=faithful I am guessing.
Shall now imagine them singing O Come All Ye Faithful in Latin. Still say it's mentioned too much.

#35: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:08 am
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The way EBD seems to believe it's acceptable for anyone to describe their juniors as 'kids'.

#36: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:07 pm
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Jennie wrote:

The way EBD seems to believe it's acceptable for anyone to describe their juniors as 'kids'.

Regrettably, EBD isn't alone in that. I've heard teacher friends of mine referring to their pupils as 'kids'. I've even heard the PM doing it in speeches about education. (Here's a man who is highly educated, holds a responsible position, using slang in public. What would Hilda say?)

#37: Author: Lisa A., Location: North Yorkshire

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:51 pm
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I find use of "kids / babes / infants" for girls of around thirteen a bit annoying - surely even in those days a teenager would find this a bit much even from a prefect?? And do all naughty Middles have to be imps and demons?

#38: Author: Dreaming Marianne, Location: Second star to the right

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 4:17 pm
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Agree with everyone regarding "Goes to the Oberland".

And also, why does everyone "go in for" nursing/archaeology/games mistress? That irritates me no end!

"Golden voice"

Yep, Joey using the word "hanes" right left and centre whilst EBD does this little knowing aside to the audience.

#39: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 4:35 pm
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And if they aren't "going in" they're "hoeing in" Laughing

#40: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 6:10 pm
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I don't like the way everything is "pretty". EBD seems to have a kind of "everything-must-have-an-adjective" problem, and when she can't think of one she puts "pretty". EJO has the same problem, with "big".

#41: Author: Lisa A., Location: North Yorkshire

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 6:35 pm
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A bit off-topic but Jacqueline Wilson does it with "special". I find myself on edge waiting for the next one.

Back to CS, there are the sentences which go something like "nothing happened that week, with Joey falling down the stairs, Simone getting locked in the lavatory and Madge's hair dropping out not counting at all." Odd, as sometimes the type of incidents listed get a whole chapter elsewhere.

#42: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:26 pm
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And grins always have to be 'impish' or 'mischievous'

#43: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2007 5:15 am
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What, no evil grins? Twisted Evil

Re the background checks and related discussion - some of the worst cases of child abuse have been the ones that go on for years, involve multiple children, and are perpetuated by someone who is a well respected member of society, or a person in a position of authority and trust (teacher, minister, coach, etc.). People who do that thing are fortunately rare, but they seek out situations where they have access to children with minimal supervision. If they haven't been caught they won't have a record, but I think that some of the basic precautions that are standard now are a good idea - having more than one adult in charge of a group, educating children about what is and isn't acceptable and what to do if they are in trouble, things like that.

The danger, of course, is becoming overly paranoid, but I think it is important to be aware that dangerous people don't necessarily huddle in corners muttering to themselves, and aren't always known to be dangerous, so knowing some of the warning signs and being able to identify potentially dodgy situations can go a long way.

They did do some of that in the early Chalet school - the choir practices always have a female chaperone, along with Mr Denny, although they don't do that for Herr Anserl or Herr Laubach.

#44: Author: Kathy_S, Location: midwestern US

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:56 am
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I don't think "kids" is that uncommon for people much older than 13, even among the generation of my students. I've never heard "babes" and "infants" applied in this way personally, but have read a fair number of early and mid-20th century series books that portray them in regular use, e.g. when sophomores are referring to freshmen.

Quote:

"Why can't they be like we were, perfect in every way?
What's the matter with kids today?"- song from Bye Bye Birdie, 1958, definitely not referring to small children.

#45: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 2:08 pm
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I really hate 'humanly speaking'.

#46: Author: Dawn, Location: Leeds, West Yorks

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:09 pm
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Kathy_S wrote:

I don't think "kids" is that uncommon for people much older than 13, even among the generation of my students.

I still tend to refer to our 3 as "the kids" and Jess is 18 and the boys almost 16 Embarassed

#47: Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:41 pm
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jennifer wrote:

but I think that some of the basic precautions that are standard now are a good idea - having more than one adult in charge of a group, educating children about what is and isn't acceptable and what to do if they are in trouble, things like that.

Sigh. Yes. Except my daughter would have been deprived of a relationship with her Girls' Brigade Captain which was extremely valuable to her in her growing years - Captain, who lives just round the corner from us, would walk the daughter home at the end of the evening, and they became great friends, something that couldn't happen nowadays. Which would have been a pity - she needed an adult friend who wasn't related!

Coming back on topic, I hate it when EBD misuses "literally" and says someone "literally crawled back to her seat". Er - I don't think so! She would have walked "on her own arched insteps", as EBD is also apt to say.

#48: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:49 pm
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'It is on record that - '

Where? Who recorded it?

#49: Author: Pat, Location: Doncaster

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 4:29 pm
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Dawn wrote:

Kathy_S wrote:

I don't think "kids" is that uncommon for people much older than 13, even among the generation of my students.

I still tend to refer to our 3 as "the kids" and Jess is 18 and the boys almost 16 Embarassed

We do the same - and our kids are both in their 30s!!!

#50: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 5:26 pm
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Pat wrote:

Dawn wrote:

Kathy_S wrote:

I don't think "kids" is that uncommon for people much older than 13, even among the generation of my students.

I still tend to refer to our 3 as "the kids" and Jess is 18 and the boys almost 16 Embarassed

We do the same - and our kids are both in their 30s!!!

Was talking with my Mum the other day about a family do in a couple of months and automatically said something about 'the boys will both be there' - that's my brothers - aged 35 and 39! Laughing

Well they are my Mum's 'boys' and they are both younger than I! Wink

#51: Author: Kate, Location: Ireland

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 6:02 pm
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I was talking to an elderly lady - a friend of my gran's - recently. I was trying to explain to her who I was and said I was "one of the Murphys". She said "ah yes, you're from the family in which one of the boys died recently." I was a bit confused by this, but eventually realised she meant my father, who was 51 when he died!

#52: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 8:44 pm
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I still call my two 'the boys' and Andrew will be forty-one this May.

#53: Author: genka, Location: New Zealand

Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 4:07 am
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Just found this in Richenda and thought it was a bit ironic Rolling Eyes

Quote:

“I like all the mistresses here, so far. Miss Ferrars, our form mistress, is a poppet”—Richenda, like most girls of her age, was given to repetition of epithets—

#54: Author: JoS, Location: South Africa

Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 12:25 pm
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EBD describing herself it seems.

#55: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 5:31 pm
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You know, I quite like the way the characters talk in CS and I like a lot of the things that other people seem to find annoying - eg, use of 'literally'. I always read that as EBD entering into the mind of hyperbole-prone teenage girls. And 'hanes' - I thought it was nice that Joey kept on using the word.

#56: Author: Squirrel, Location: St-Andrews or Dunfermline

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:41 am
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In some ways this is interesting to me. A friend of mine has commented recently about a habit I have developed of referring to anyone from birth up to 8 or 9 as an 'infant'. I guess I now know where that habit has come from!

#57: Author: JustJen, Location: at a baseball game

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:27 pm
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Wild Irish girl/scamp annoys me.

#58: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:31 pm
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Loryat wrote:

And 'hanes' - I thought it was nice that Joey kept on using the word.

Yes, I like that the school and its associates picked up local words and phrases: but it bothers me that "hanes" is the ONLY Welsh word that ANY of them ever learnt. Even Joey, who can learn Russian in four pages, can't learn any Welsh in six books...

My latest gripe is characters saying "I agree". It just doesn't seem natural to me: you'd say "yes" or "you're quite right" or "that's a point", you wouldn't say "I agree" in casual speech, unless there was an argument and you were specifying "I agree with Simone" or "I agree that it's lunchtime".

#59: Author: Mrs Redboots, Location: London, UK

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:47 pm
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Tiffany wrote:

Even Joey, who can learn Russian in four pages, can't learn any Welsh in six books...

Well, don't forget she did spend a lot of the time in Canada. But she does speak some Welsh - do you remember the scene in (I think) "Carola" when either she leaves the brakes off the pram or Mike bounces so hard that he jolts them off, and some kids catch the pram just before it goes into the road - she speaks to them in Welsh and gives them some sweets.

But am I not right in thinking that the Island is meant to be off the coast of South Wales, which I think is the English-speaking part (certainly people didn't speak Welsh anything like as much as they do in North Wales, when I visited), and Plas Howell, despite it's name is still in England. So she may not have been exposed to all that much Welsh.

#60: Author: claire, Location: South Wales

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:21 pm
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I think she gives them sweets because she can't thank them in Welsh

#61: Author: Chelsea, Location: Your Imagination

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:16 pm
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claire wrote:

I think she gives them sweets because she can't thank them in Welsh

That is my memory as well. I think that the book is "Peggy"

#62: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:16 pm
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claire wrote:

I think she gives them sweets because she can't thank them in Welsh

She does - it's in Peggy.

Quote:

"I say, Auntie Jo, wasn't that your sweet ration?"

"Yes; but I couldn't thank them in Welsh, and I had to do something about it, hadn't I?"

You really would think that someone who picked up languages so easily could at least have managed to learn the words for "Thank you"!!

#63: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 8:39 am
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Maybe EBD didn't know any Welsh - or rather, knew even less Welsh than she did German and French... Wink

- and decided she couldn't fake it / it was too hard to fake it.

I suspect EBD wrote her terrible (people tell me) French and German herself without consulting anyone, becuase she thought she knew those languages. Knowing no Welsh, it probably didn't occur to her to go find a Welsh speaker and ask them to translate a few phrases for her, becuase it's not what she would normally do - she was used to relying on her own resources / guide books, rather than consulting an expert.

I do agree, though - it's a definite error in Joey's characterisation not to have her pick up at least a few words here and there. We are, after all, constantly told what a "fly paper for languages" she is.

#64: Author: Mel, Location: UP NORTH

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:11 pm
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EBD could have had her knowing some Welsh without actually using the words. She does this with Russian, Belsornian and Romany quite happily. It is odd that Jo isn't chattering like a native within days!

#65: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:08 pm
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I wonder if there's some kind of (subconscious) implication that Welsh isn't a "nice" language to know? I haven't got my books here so I can't check, but I remember getting the impression that Welsh was spoken by servants/gardeners/working class - people like Gwensi speak it, but only so they can give orders. Does anyone know whether real-life Welsh had any particular status problems?

#66: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:15 pm
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Tiffany, you may have something there. I don't know whether Welsh has or had those connotations, but I can believe the EBD, running her school in a "big house" not far from the Welsh border, might have only met Welsh speakers in the form of domestic staff, local trades people and shop keepers etc. So, it might not have been a true perception, but it might have been her perception at the time.

Certainly, it seems implied in the books that Gwensi speaks Welsh to the Plas Howell servents and local poachers etc. but English to her family - if she spoke Welsh to her folks, I would have thought she would favour it over English, but she doesn't e.g. revert to Welsh at times of stress (unless said stress is caused by Welsh poachers of course!).

#67: Author: KB, Location: Melbourne, Australia

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:27 pm
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I wondered if there might not also be the education element. EBD would know that quite a lot of her readers would be learning French and German at school, but that only a very small minority would know Welsh. Therefore she doesn't need to translate all of her French and German remarks, but I bet if she had lots of Welsh that always had to be translated, we would be complaining about how boring that was!

#68: Author: Rosie, Location: Land of Three-Quarters Sky

Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:43 pm
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I think Welsh was being actively stamped out at the time - children could be pretty severely punished for speaking it in school.

#69: Author: Clare, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 5:54 pm
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Having vague memories of a history lesson where we were told one of the ways they stamped down on Welsh was making pupils wear a sign if they were caught speaking it. Or am I making it up?

I was reading Bride last night and came across another phrase I hate - "having flung her bomb, Miss Annersley sat back to watch its effect." (Or words to that effect). I remember that phrase jumping out at me when I first read it and I just hated it on the spot. It's such a violent way of describing the fact Miss A. had brought startling news to Bride.

#70: Author: claire, Location: South Wales

Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 7:15 pm
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Caroline wrote:

Maybe EBD didn't know any Welsh - or rather, knew even less Welsh than she did German and French... Wink

- and decided she couldn't fake it / it was too hard to fake it.

Can't be that as she gets the village children to reply to her in Welsh (even if she does mess it up with lack of mutation)

#71: Author: Tara, Location: Malvern, Worcestershire

Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2007 11:53 pm
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As with most countries that have been colonised, the language was considered dangerous, and children were forbidden to speak it at school (and did have a board hung round their neck as a punishment). What I can't at all remember is the date when such things started/changed. I was born in 1947, and Welsh was certainly being actively taught by the time I was at school. It was compulsory until age 14, and there were (very good) Welsh-medium schools well established by then, too.

#72: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:07 pm
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Another thing I really hate is that the Robin is always described as a baby, even when she's in her teens, and she's always described as 'trotting', never walking or running.

#73: Author: Róisín, Location: Ireland

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:08 pm
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Jennie wrote:

Another thing I really hate is that the Robin is always described as a baby, even when she's in her teens, and she's always described as 'trotting', never walking or running.

Makes her sound like she had hooves. Maybe she was secretly a faun. Laughing

#74: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:27 pm
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Inappropriate use of "little" or "small". Most annoying example - when Grizel's dad buys her some books on Guiding, she's described as "his small daughter" (or could've been "his little daughter") although she's 14/15 at the time Rolling Eyes

#75: Author: Jennie, Location: Cambridgeshire

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:28 pm
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And 'unsentimental' Jo calling her 'Littlest and best.' when Robin's ten and there are younger girls at the school and the Russells have a child.

#76: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 2:52 pm
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What used to irritate me hugely although funnily enough it doesn't so much now, is when she uses someone's full name for no apparent reason. She used to do it all the time with Joey. It just seemed dead corny to me.

#77: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 3:31 pm
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Loryat wrote:

What used to irritate me hugely although funnily enough it doesn't so much now, is when she uses someone's full name for no apparent reason. She used to do it all the time with Joey. It just seemed dead corny to me.

JK Rowling does this too, and it bothers me. I guess the reason, in both cases, is to convey the idea of a great big cast of pupils known to the characters, though not necessarily to the readers. Specifiyng "Mary-Lou Trelawney" signifies that there are lots of other Mary-Lous (what a terrifying thought).

#78: Author: Phil, Location: London UK

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:35 pm
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Overuse of the word brat annoys me. Jack continually refers to his "brats". I've always felt brat is a word to describe an irritating child and meant with a good deal of unpleasantness. I wouldn't like it if my father kept calling me a brat.

#79: Author: Emerence, Location: Australia

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:24 am
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Maybe it's their "endearing" way of calling someone a sausage - my little bratwursts Laughing

#80: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:38 pm
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Tiffany wrote:

Loryat wrote:

It doesn't bother me when she does it in that way, because I aways liked the way it conveys a mass cast. It annoys me when she seems to be doing it for effect - for example, when someone's seriously ill she'll use their full name. One place where it always annoyed me was in Rivals where she says that 'Joey Bettany was down with pleuro-pneumonia'.

#81: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:47 pm
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Loryat wrote:

I suppose it helps new readers, or people reading the books out of order, to keep track of who's who. Similarly when she has characters saying things like 'Biddy O'Ryan - I mean Courvoisier'.

#82: Author: Clare, Location: Liverpool

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:00 pm
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I notice it every now and agian. In the early books in particular "Joey Bettany" crops up every couple of pages.

#83: Author: Squirrel, Location: St-Andrews or Dunfermline

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:14 pm
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It was one of the earlier books where this got me, I suppose it's really an EBD-ism, but there was a snowball fight, and Joey had either done something different, or been out of it, then there was a reference to a Joy Bettany. Each time I come across it I look at it and wonder if it's EBD forgetting what happened overleaf, or if there is some suddenly new character who is really Joy Bettany - now I can see *lots* of fun being had if there was a new character called Joy Bettany in the early books.

#84: Author: Róisín, Location: Ireland

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:33 pm
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The constant giving-of-full-names is one of my favourite things about EBD's writing! It makes it easier to follow, not having to remember them yourself. Also, it is a schooly thing to do - in my school anyway we were always called full names because there was usually more than one girl with the one name ie there were 5 Marys etc. Also, maybe using the full name made EBD think of boys' school traditions - where the boys are invariably known *only* by their surname.*

*I never got this. Is it a 'man' thing? And it is *still* the thing to do. What is wrong with their first names?!

#85: Author: Kathy_S, Location: midwestern US

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:44 pm
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*agrees with Róisín*

The full names didn't strike me as out of place at all. There are any number of childhood friends & acquaintances still called by full name-or-nickname-plus-unmarried-surname, even in person. One of my 2nd sister's friends even introduced herself that way last month, just so we'd know who we were really talking to.*

ETA *with whom we were really speaking. Sorry, Miss A.

Last edited by Kathy_S on Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:12 pm; edited 1 time in total

#86: Author: Lesley, Location: Allhallows, Kent

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:00 pm
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Speaking from a writing POV - it helps break up the monotony having a choice of names/titles that you can use for any one individual. Rather than just the one name.

#87: Author: Lisa A., Location: North Yorkshire

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:10 pm
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I used to find all the names very off-putting - I remember complaining once (as a child before coming to my senses!) that CS books were just lists of names with not much happening. I actually find it quite useful now, especially with the gaps in my collection, for keeping up with who's who, so it certainly fulfils that role well, if that was the intention.

I often find the little descriptions a bit irritating ("so-and-so of the bright blue eyes, cheeky nose etc.) but again they are useful prompts.

#88: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:49 am
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The lists of names are also one of the things typically cut in paperback editions, as well as references to old girls and minor characters. If you're reading one book, it makes sense, as the recitation of old girls etc can bog down the narrative, but if you're reading the series as a whole, it enriches it, giving a connection with whole sweep of the story over many years.

I agree on the full names too - there are characters with the same or similar first names, and it does vary the descriptions a bit. There are actually very few characters (on order of a dozen or so) who *don't* have first names given. It also helps with figuring out who is really meant in typos.

I find some of the stock descriptions a bit grating - "typically French looking", "high bred English face", "frank, cheerful Englishwoman" etc.

#89: Author: LizzieC, Location: Canterbury, UK

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:03 pm
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I hope you don't mind me bringing this up again but I'm new (I know what my join date says but I joined and then forgot all about this board!) and I was reading through this thread and had a couple to add (both about staff).

The first is saying that someone gave someone a lecture that she never bettered. There were a lot of lectures that were never bettered at the Chalet School, usually all given by the same person (Miss Annersley).

The other is "what went on in that room nobody but the two concerned ever knew" which usually ends in a character coming out completely reformed Rolling Eyes

I suppose it was a convenient way of dealing with problem pupils and turning them into real Chalet School Girls.

#90: Author: Tiffany, Location: Is this a duck I see behind me?

Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:29 pm
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LizzieC wrote:

The other is "what went on in that room nobody but the two concerned ever knew" which usually ends in a character coming out completely reformed Rolling Eyes

I suppose it was a convenient way of dealing with problem pupils and turning them into real Chalet School Girls.

I suspect that what actually happened was that the sinning girl was bumped off by discreet hitmen, and a Chaletesque replacement - probably the daughter of an Old Girl, that's why they don't feature much in the books as themselves - was put in her place to be the reformed character.

#91: Author: Loryat,

Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 11:36 am
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Lol. Very Happy

The CBB -> Anything Else

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