The CBB :: View topic - Parenting Styles

through

#1: Parenting Styles Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 7:46 am
—
It's interesting to look at the different parenting styles in the La Rochelle books, particularly the three Temple girls.

Elizabeth and Paul are rich, indulgent parents, who give their children everything and don't have much in the way of expectations. Their kids are known for being hellions at worst, and lazy, good natured and inclined to slide through life with little knowledge of the price of things at best.

Peter and Anne are loving but firm parents - there is a clear separation between parent and child, and the children are expected to be respectful. They are, however, proud, and unwilling to accept help from others, and Anne is very indulgent of Barbara as a child. As a results, there is one bad incident with Beth as a child, which nearly warps her character, and Barbara narrowly avoids being a spoiled wretch. However, their kids in general are responsible, well behaved, and pragmatic when it comes to financial realities.

Janie and Julian are much more casual with their kids, teasing and playing with them more than Peter and Anne. They do exert firm discipline, although generally done with humour. Their kids are generally good natured but prone to naughtiness - they won't break rules, but if there isn't a specific rule against it, they'll do it. They grow into nice, generally well behaved kids, neither too young or too old for their ages.

Interestingly, both the Chester and Lucy families have a youngest daughter who is the most naughty/least hard working of the bunch.

#2: Author: Ruth B, Location: Oxford, UK

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 10:30 am
—
I have to say that out of all the parenting styles EBD portrays, the Lucy's are my favourite. They seem to strike the balance between friendship and discipline well and Julian seems much closer and involved than other EBD fathers. And the kids talking about "Forbids" is just so cute!

#3: Author: Róisín, Location: Gaillimh

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:45 am
—
It struck me how different Elizabeth's parenting style was with her own children to how it was with Janie.

#4: Author: JayB, Location: SE England

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:52 pm
—

Róisín wrote:

It struck me how different Elizabeth's parenting style was with her own children to how it was with Janie.

I was going to say the same. I haven't read all the La Rochelle books, but I do remember Elizabeth being quite firm with Janie inMaids. I also remember Paul being fairly strict with Pauline. Maybe it was over-reaction to finding themselves sole guardians of young relatives at a young age? Plus the need to be careful with money probably made Elizabeth more disciplined before she married.

#5: Author: Chair, Location: Rochester, Kent

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:57 pm
—

Róisín wrote:

It struck me how different Elizabeth's parenting style was with her own children to how it was with Janie.

Maybe Janie saw Elizabeth's mistakes and realised she could have a better way of handling things.

#6: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:22 pm
—
Maybe the fact that Janie and Julian are much younger parents than the others also contributes. EBD comments several times with other families that mother and daughters were more like friends than parent / child, as the mother was very young (e.g. Mollie Bettany). Older mothers don't seem to demonstrate this sense of fun / cameraderie (e.g. Madge).

Also, Janie has had a more carefree existence than either of her older sisters, and was able to marry young, without much angst. Both Elizabeth and Anne had (to some extend) their young adulthood marred by poverty and worry and having to effectively bring up Janie, and both fell in love only to believe for some months that they will not be able to marry / cannot tell anyone how they feel.

I can see all this contributing to very different parenting styles.

#7: Author: macyrose, Location: Great White North (Canada)

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:45 pm
—
There's an interesting discussion in Adrienne where Len and Margot Maynard as well as Ailie Russell and Janice Chester talk about their parents and their respective parenting styles:

Quote:

“This is a party,” Ailie remarked. “I say, Len, I do think Sybs might have come to England for her wedding. It means that none of you folk will be there and it’s the first in the family. I do think Sybs might have thought of that earlier.”
“Oh, well, in that case I suppose her bridegroom’s folk wouldn’t have been able to be present,” Len said. “It cuts both ways, you know, Ailie.”
“There’s something in that,” Ailie owned. “Anyhow, I’ll see you folk get a good-sized chunk of the cake and if I can bag any bells or things from its ornaments for you, I will. I’ll tell Mum. I expect she’ll see the point when I explain it to her. She’s quite good at that sort of thing.”
“She’s not the only one,” Margot said. “So’s our mum. In fact, when you come to think of it, as a family – I mean all of us and the Bettanys – we’re jolly lucky in our parents. It isn’t often they try to come the heads of the family over us once we’re old enough to see sense. And they do see that one has one’s own point of view and will listen to it, even if they don’t agree with it. I suppose,” she added thoughtfully, “that’s too much for anyone to expect, even in these days.”
Adrienne listened to the talk, wide-eyed. She herself had been on unusually easy terms with her father, but she had never ventured to argue a command he had issued. Neither, unless she was asked for it, would she have stated her own opinions. Yet she had heard the Maynards discuss things with their mother almost as if they belonged to the same generation. Did all English families behave so, she wondered.
“You look a trifle dazed,” Janice remarked, joining her. “Anything wrong? Or are you feeling overdone?”
“But no. I feel very well. It is just – ” she paused.
“Well? Just – what?” Janice demanded. “What’s biting you?”
“I am amazed at the way you English girls seem to speak to your parents.”
“What? What do you mean?” Janice was staring at her.
“Why, it is almost as if – as they were of the same – same – ah, I forget the word. Not age – no; but – ”
“I suppose you mean the same generation. Well, but don’t you think that’s a compliment to them?” Janice asked lightly.
Adrienne shook her head. “Me, I do not understand. I do not think it would be permitted in France. La jeune fille is expected to remember that she is a daughter and owes reverence to her parents.”
“Gosh! How ghastly! Of course, I know that even people like Mélanie Lucas is – is – well, more formal, if you like, to her father and mother. My own folk would take running jumps if I spoke to them as I’ve heard Solly de Chaumontel speak to her aunt or the Merciers to their father that time he came last summer. What’s more, I should hate it myself. Oh, I’ve never been allowed to be cheeky – especially,” she gave a sudden grin, “if Dad was anywhere in the offing – ”
“How ‘offing’, if you please?” Adrienne was not letting this pass.
“It’s – well it means neighbourhood. It’s a sailor expression.”
“Ah, I understand. Excuse me, please, and continue with what you were saying. I have much interest, for it seems to me that English girls have so much more freedom than we who are French.
“Why,” Janice said without further comment, “what I was going to say was that we’ve never been allowed to cheek people. In fact, I think Mummy and Dad are pretty strict that way – lots more so than our Aunt Janie and Uncle Julian Lucy. You don’t know, of course, but all our Lucy cousins have been at school here and, in fact, Kitten, the youngest of the bunch, is coming in September. Well, now I come to think of it, that crowd talk to their folk just as the Maynards talk to theirs and –and so on.”

It seems like the Bettanys and Maynards are more like the Lucy's in parenting styles while Madge and Jem are more like Anne and Peter. Perhaps this is because, as Caroline mentioned, Jo and Mollie were married very young while Madge and Anne (and Elizabeth) were older when they married. Though there doesn't seem to be that big an age difference in when Janie was married than when Madge was and they're portrayed as having very different parenting styles. Janie was twenty-three (in Janie) while Madge was twenty six (I think). Does anyone know how old Anne and Elizabeth were when they married?

I too think the Lucy's have the best balance in parenting style.

#8: Author: Alison H, Location: Manchester

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:53 pm
—
It probably made a difference that Madge, Elizabeth and to some extent Anne had all had to "mother" younger sisters when they were only young themselves. Presumably some sort of nanny was employed to look after Joey when she was a baby because Madge was only 12 then, but Madge seems to've been the only one looking after her by School At.

I can imagine Jem being very strict as well - I can't imagine any of the kids daring to wind him up! I can't even imagine people teasing him the way the other adults tease Jack, e.g. in Rescue (I think) when Marie teases Jack about his hair.

#9: Author: Cath V-P, Location: Newcastle NSW

Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 12:23 am
—
Another difference is that EBD never showed Madge, Elizabeth or Anne as anything other than adults with adult responsibilities, whereas Joey and Janie grow up through the course of several books, and possibly this also had something to do with it.

#10: Author: Fiona Mc, Location: Bendigo, Australia

Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 8:54 am
—

Alison H wrote:

I can imagine Jem being very strict as well - I can't imagine any of the kids daring to wind him up! I can't even imagine people teasing him the way the other adults tease Jack, e.g. in Rescue (I think) when Marie teases Jack about his hair.

But all the girls at the school in the early years teased him and he was known for continually teasing and pulling their legs. It seemed to stop more when Jack came along, and it was also described in one of the books that Madge was stricter with the kids than Jem and only Sybil spilling hot water on Josette did it reverse and Madge forgave instantly while Jem was wild.

#11: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 11:57 am
—
Interestingly, Jack is shown as much more of a disciplinarian that Joey in a number of cases. When the triplets are little, Joey hides Margot's behaviour from him when he's home. Later, she admits that she can be coaxed on occasion , but Jack can't once he's put his foot down. He is also the one who has the insistence on instant and unquestioning obedience, and gets most angry at disobedience or lateness or disrespect. He's the one who is furious to the point having to restrain himself from violence when Mike goes over the cliff, and shuns Margot for weeks after the blackmailing incident.

From Future

Quote:

Dad's so strict about obedience - with us, at any rate; and I don't
suppose he'll let up for Melanie. He always says disobedience is the
beginning of all sorts of trouble.

Quote:

Dad was easy enough as a rule, but when he spoke like that, you
listened - or else!

---

Anne I see as thoroughy adult - she's not one to play with her kids, and she had been aged and sobered by added responsiblity and grief. Janie's a naturally bubbly, cheerful, enthusiastic girl who is maturing with grace and acceptance of her increased responsibilities, without getting stuffy. Madge gets stuffy quickly, possibly pulled down by all her responsiblities - the school management, Joey, Juliet, Robin, being the wife of a prominent doctor, her brother's four children, her sister in law's two children and her own batch of kids, moving all of the above to Guerney ahead of a war, Lady Russell, etc.

Joey protests too much about her girlishness and youthfulness - she resents growing up as an adolescent and does everything she can to avoid responsiblity and adulthood. It seems a bit over the top, like she can't admit even to herself that she's a forty year old woman with eleven kids and is no longer a school girl, by any stretch of the imagination

#12: Author: Changnoi, Location: Milwaukee, USA

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:31 am
—
Although I like the Lucys, I don't really feel able to compare them with the Chesters, because the Chesters have gone through so much more difficulty than the Lucys.

I think that probably, when you are able to leave your children with servants a good deal of the time, as Janie Lucy (and Joey) do, you probably tend to feel less burnt-out when you're with them, less stern, and so forth, because you already have someone to be disciplinarian for all of the litte things. If you are responsible for all your children and can't leave them to help and additionally you have a very frail child who is always on the verge of dropping dead and additionally you never thought you were going to have these kinds of responsibilities in your life, I can see how it's less easy to joke and play with the kids and easier to be a bit stern and draw the line firmly.

I must say I really support Anne Chester because I think she deals with a tremendous amount of...stuff...and does it with more dogged persistence and much less hysteria than Joey. I can picture--vaguely!--having six or seven or however many children the Chesters have and relying on the thirteen-year-old for help just because I'm SO WORN OUT and trying to keep the family together and trying to keep things from looking so bad to the extended family and in-laws. If it were Joey, she'd just go to bed with something in her drink until someone else could take over, but Anne keeps on going, and I think we can see how much she mourns the life that she is giving to Beth but also how much she wants to keep her family's straits to herself.

I didn't realize I liked Anne Chester so much until I wrote this!

I also do like the Ozanne twins because they are so lazy and go to the Chalet School and are never reformed. And I like Bad Bill and Mike in Janie Steps In. But Elizabeth and Paul really don't seem to hold the family to any kind of standard.

Chang

#13: Author: Róisín, Location: Gaillimh

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 10:47 pm
—
Anne is my favourite character when they are all still Temples, and her relationship with Peter is also nicer than Elizabeth/Paul; I don't like that we don't see more of her after she marries Sad

And her art is forgotten too, even though she is such a protegée in her first book.

#14: Author: LizB, Location: Oxon, England

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 1:39 pm
—
Although Peter's first 'proposal' (admittedly he does it a bit better later on) is right up (or down) there with 'I guess we're engaged then'!

#15: Author: Róisín, Location: Gaillimh

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 1:53 pm
—
Oh no Liz, I thought it was sweet the way he said the two girls could be their bridesmaids! It was charming in a kind of confident way. Very Happy

#16: Author: Caroline, Location: Manchester

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:12 pm
—

Changnoi wrote:

I also do like the Ozanne twins because they are so lazy and go to the Chalet School and are never reformed. And I like Bad Bill and Mike in Janie Steps In. But Elizabeth and Paul really don't seem to hold the family to any kind of standard.

Chang

Yes, and this is the parenting style I find inexplicable. I can buy Janie and Julian's laissez faire, I can buy Anne and Peter's treatment of Barbara and Beth (just!), but I can't understand how Elizabeth and Paul - a stately, elegant woman and a highly educated lawyer and community leader, both of whom have previously helped to bring up younger siblings / half-siblings - end up with lazy, running-wild children. And, what is more, don't seem to care.

What's even more weird is that EBD makes no attempt to explain why the Ozanne children turn out as they do. In most of her other parenting examples we get some mitigating circumstances or explanation for why the children end up as they do, but with the Ozannes we are obviously just supposed to accept that that is the way they are - lazy twins, bad boys.

Tis most strange!

#17: Author: Gabrielle, Location: Near Paris, France

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:16 pm
—

Caroline wrote:

I agree. Elizabeth seems to be so nice and normal when she is raising Janie and then her own kids. It is almost like EBD got tired of her so she basically turned her into a bad mother.

I am certainly not an expert on children or child-rearing but I do know there are some children it is harder to get to obey than others. However EBD appears to know even less about children than I do so I can't quite explain it. It is a shame she sort of lets the Ozanne twins fade away because they are interesting characters. In fact it is a shame she lets all of them fade away.

#18: Author: francesn, Location: away with the faeries

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 7:35 pm
—
Although I know this is fiction I can't help hypothesising that Paul and Elizabeth got too used to their nice liefstyle to pay attention to their children and didn't instill that discipline in the early years. So they weren't setting a good example to their children. And lazy twins could be explained by knowing that they were secure whatever they did, so they didn't NEED to work.

Maybe...

#19: Author: jennifer, Location: Taiwan

Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 4:53 am
—
Or they based their experiences on parenting their half siblings - Pauline and Janie are already half raised when they take charge, so they have experience with the latter third of parenting, dealing with the teen years as well as fairly motivated kids.

However, their own kids come as unformed infants, and they aren't expecting to have to deal with the early development of character and discipline.

Now I really want to read Maids of La Rochelle. I've read Gerry Goes to School and Heather Leaves School onwards, but not the three middle books. Sad

#20: Author: Fiona Mc, Location: Bendigo, Australia

Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:13 am
—
It's funny but I don't really see Paula dn Elisabeth as being bad parents. Easy going yes but all their children are basicaly nice kids. Bad Bill is naughty but it doesn't have any nastiness attached to it. The twins may be lazy but they are kind hearted, loyal and never seem to hold a grudge for very long. If laziness is the worse you can say about them then Paul and Elizabeth must have done something right.

The CBB -> Anything Else

output generated using printer-friendly topic mod. All times are GMT + 1 Hour

Page 1 of 1