Joyce Linton
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#1: Joyce Linton Author: Rachael PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:55 pm


Please discuss Joyce here:

 


#2:  Author: JennieLocation: Cambridgeshire PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 6:27 pm


Selfish, self-centred, immature, vain, demanding, a trouble-maker. I did sympathise with her on two occasions. Why should she be expected to kiss the Robin when she's only just met her? Of course, I'm looking at it from a present-day POV, but EBD does let her characters get away with a lot of things that would be frowned on nowadays. I also felt sorry for her when Thekla von Stift tried to make her misbehave, but in one way that was a good thing, because it helped Joyce to grow up and to see that her behaviour might affect her mother's state of health and continuing survival.

 


#3:  Author: patmacLocation: Yorkshire England PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 6:55 pm


I think Jennie has covered most of what I would say except that she was babied and overprotected by her mother and Gillian so no wonder she was spoilt! Her mother had not been ill all Joyce's life and has to take some of the blame - both for Joyce's immaturity and Gillian's overdeveloped sense of responsibilty. She came good in the end so - Huzzah for the CS!

 


#4:  Author: BuntyLocation: London PostPosted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 11:16 am


It's been said before - but Joyce is a good example of EBD's mistrust of conventional physical attractiveness. It's stated quite explicitly that it's her angelic prettiness that has caused her to be so spoilt at home and gives her her hold over other girls, coupled with what are called her 'pretty ways' - though I've never been sure what these actually are, as she always seems very slangy, casual and stroppy in conversation! Gillian, of course, is regarded as more attractive by the discerning characters, as her looks are more distinctive than Joyce's doll-like pink-and-whiteness - and because, presumably, her face shows genuine character. I'm wondering as I type this why Marie and Wanda should be allowed to be adored for their beauty, when it's something that is supposed to have wrecked Joyce and I wonder whether it's because they come from 'ethnic minorities' and can be praised safely because their innate sense of inferiority to the English girls will prevent their becoming swelled-headed? Or, more charitably to the text perhaps, because their continental upbringing is so much stricter and their moral fibre more assured? I do find quite convincing her attempts to reform when she realises just how ill her mother is and how much her behaviour has distressed her. She seems to stay the same person in New House and Jo Returns, unlike eg Stacie who becomes unrecognisable.

 


#5:  Author: KirstieLocation: Ayrshire PostPosted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:08 pm


I think her reformation of character did not last long. Does Joey not say something along the lines of Joyce having always been selfish when Gillian has go and help her with her children in a later book.

 


#6:  Author: DawnLocation: Leeds, West Yorks PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:20 am


Kirstie wrote:
I think her reformation of character did not last long. Does Joey not say something along the lines of Joyce having always been selfish when Gillian has go and help her with her children in a later book.
Thinks this is a bit rich coming from Joey with all her help! Joyce was left with no family to support her apart from her sister, and she had 2 children close together - ok nothing like Joey's endless stream, but enough that if there were problems (and in that era hubby wouldn't help with day to day crisis such as illness) then I dont think it's surprising that she asked for support from Gillian.

 


#7:  Author: jenniferLocation: Sunny California PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:44 am


I read the books out of order, and from references to 'Gillian having been a guardian to Joyce for years' I had always pictured them with a big gap in ages, rather than just a single year. I agree that the way Joyce is treated definitely contributes to her attitude. It doesn't seem like Gillan or her mother expect all that much from her, or trust her with much information. Joey does take a violent dislike to her right from the beginning, which would probably make Joyce very defensive, particulalry given Joey's standing in the school. She's just finished an extended voyage to an unfamiliar country, is dead tired, has a seriously ill mother, is brought into a household of people she's never met, and is promptly marked as a spoiled brat by a critical Joey, for not kissing a child she's never seen before.

 


#8:  Author: RuthLocation: Physically: Lincolnshire, England. Inwardly: The Scottish Highlands PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:34 am


I do not like Joyce. I think she is a spoiled brat, a pig-headed nuisence and a very selfish, weak person!

 


#9: joyce Author: PhilLocation: London UK PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 1:24 am


Joyce definitely needed a kick up the backside. So to speak. She was impossible and really needed a short sharp shock to bring her into line. However, I wouldn't have thought it selfish if she asks her sister for a hand if she is dealing with a sick baby, as is mentioned in one of the later books (3 go to the CS?)

 




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