Grizel
The CBB -> Book Discussions

#1: Grizel Author: Rachael PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 11:51 am


Now this should be interesting because here we have a character who is very human - blessed with plenty of flaws and a strong personality, please discuss Grizel here:

 


#2:  Author: JennieLocation: Cambridgeshire PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 5:19 pm


I always liked Grizel, and have a very soft spot for her. I think EBD gave her a very hard time of it. After detailing her past experiences, she still made no allowances for her, and just kept on about how hard her chatracter was, when she was in fact a very affectionate person, who needed to be understood. OK, she made a lot of mistakes, but it seemed to me that EBD lost very few chances of criticising Grizel, though her transgressions were no worse than Jo's. We all noted the scene in 'Camp', where it was fine for Jo to call Grizel 'child', but not right for Grizel to retaliate in kind. It was only in 'Reunion' that Grizel was allowed to have some happiness by marrying a doctor, gosh, what a surprise! It seems to me that Grizel remained unforgiven for having had her nature hardened by an unloving father and a step-mother from the same stable as the Witch Queen of Angmar! Yet we see how affectionate she was with Cookie, so we know it's there, it just needs some time, patience and security to bring it out. So why didn't EBD do it for so long?

 


#3:  Author: ElzbieLocation: London PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 5:30 pm


Grizel does get rather a hard time of it, but then she also does some stupid things. I always thought it strange that she was allowed to become HG after bogging off like she did, but on other occasions she was pulled up a bit hard, as Jennie says. I havn't read Reunion, but I think Grizel goes from being a very balanced character at school to being a hard faced cow after, with only the explanation of the music/ games thing to explain it. Now, if she was being true to form, Grizel would surely have told her dad to stick it, asked for the support of Madame/ Joey/ Mrs A, and gone off the do PT anyway. I don't understand why EBD changes her character from being headstrong but determined and straight, to inward and twisted.

 


#4:  Author: patmacLocation: Yorkshire England PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 6:26 pm


Grizel's father held the pursestrings and, as she would not 'come of age' till she was 21, I don't think anyone outside the family could have helped her. Her father would be within the law in refusing her permission to study PE. It was not uncommon to write a Trust for inheritance purposes and not make the capital available till the inheritor reached 35 - lest s/he wasted the money. I always had a soft spot for Grizel. She wasn't sent to the CS to get a good education but to get her out of her stepmother's way. I really blame her father hammer . How stupid and arrogant to not tell his new wife that he had a daughter. He set the stage for all the later problems. In some ways, she didn't handle things well and was a right nuisance with her pranks and attitudes and jealousy but I can well see the problems she had and it's a wonder she wasn't plagued by much worse symptoms. I was disappointed that EBD packed her off to the Antipodes and liked her coming back in Reunion - but really, marrying her off to a doctor who is then offered a job at the san - how feeble is that as a plot line?

 


#5:  Author: StephLocation: Blackpool, Lancashire PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 6:38 pm


I also think Grizel is hard done by in the earlier books. I felt sorry for her when her home conditions were described, especially when it was clear just how glad she really was to get away. But there was a hard side to her character- one bit in Jo of (I think) when Amy Stevens doesn't want Grizel to read her poem because she will make fun of it- and she does. So it does seems strange that she is made HG, particularly with how she seems to treat the younger girls, and especially after her stupid excursion at the beginning of Head Girl, but I got the feeling Madge etc thought of it as their last chance to do some good for her. During her time as a teacher, the hardness seems to be the only thing that people comment on (along with her prettiness) and I think it was a shame her character wasn't allowed to grow. Having just read Reunion, I thought it was a good idea of EBD's to bring her back into the series, and I really felt for her when she shows just how much Grizel has had to go through, especially compared to Joey's almost charmed life. The idea of her meeting and marrying a doctor is one that was getting VERY old by that time, but I think it is actually one of the more believable and nicer romances in the series. It is like she finally has EBD's approval after being criticised by her for most of her life.

 


#6:  Author: Joan the DwarfLocation: Er, where am I? PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 7:10 pm


There was something EBD really didn't like about Grizel - it's actually quite strange to see an author take such a dislike to a major character. [begin{cod psychology}] I wonder - from reading about EBD's life and her own character, the character in the entire series that she sounds most like is Grizel. However, as we all know, EBD wanted to be Joey. So maybe she hates Grizel because she dislikes the bits in herself that aren't Joey-like? Grizel is how she was, Joey is how she wanted to be. [/end{cod psychology}] I'm reading Rivals at the moment - and boy does Grizel get a hard time there! She turns up at the start of the chicken-pox epidemic, and Madge takes one look at her and says basically, not you on top of everything else! Think about it: apart from being stormingly rude and unloving, this girl was head-girl the term before, and is coming into a situation where an extra authority-figure would be extremely useful - it just doesn't make sense for Madge to react like that. And contrast with the reaction when Joey is dumped on the school the term after she leaves! Can we start a Grizel fanclub? [NB with the Joey/Grizel thing in Camp, I think it can (just!) be rescued. Joey calls Grizel "my child" which is a term used between equals elsewhere, whereas calling someone simply "child" is always very much used to an inferior. Joey was presumptuous, but the comments weren't the same.]

 


#7:  Author: jenniferLocation: Sunny California PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2004 7:31 pm


Grizel's one of the few really complex characters in the series, who isn't turned into the perfect Chalet Girl. I would definitely agree that A) Grizel is hard done by in EBD terms - she's one of the very few characters who doesn't have a life altering change of heart after her escapades. It is, however, a more realistic approach. She definitely has a prickly character, the kind that can be very rewarding to get to know, but that takes a lot more effort than Joey's easy friendliness. B) She's a poor choice for headgirl. She is prickly, doesn't have a lot of empathy for other girls and frequently gets people's back up with her attitude. She'd be a good choice for a prefect in an area where she doesn't have to work with the girls one on one, or with careful supervision to make sure she doesn't step over the line in her behavior. I would also add C) She's the last person who should have been forced to be a teacher. She doesn't want to teach, and she doesn't want to study music, but has to. She's sarcastic, impatient and quick tempered, and bitter about her lack of choice. That's something guarenteed to make music lessons seriously unpleasant for the girls. Her choice, if she defied her father, would be limited. She wouldn't have the money to pursue further training. She doesn't really have the background skills for a lot of the other acceptable careers for women in those days - nurse and teacher would require further training, and aren't suited to her temperment, her education hasn't really been focussed towards secraterial/clerical work, she wouldn't really have the domestic skills for housekeeping/maid/governess. Pursuing anything non traditional would be difficult without parental support. Getting up every morning, doing something you hated, and knowing the only reason you aren't doing something you like is because your father doesn't care about you could make almost anyone bitter.

 


#8:  Author: SusanLocation: Carlisle PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 10:39 am


I almost feel sorry for Grizel in the end. Her mother dies when she is very young and she is packed of to live with her grandmother who spoils her. Her father remarries, doesn't tell his wife he has a daughter then expects the second wife to raise her and doesn't seem able to interfere or bothered that the child is treated very unfairly and even harshly. Then she is packed off to school albeit with people that both she and her parents knew. No wonder she is a crazy mixed up kid. Then as she grows up and formulates her ideas of what she would like to do with her life, she is told in no uncertain terms that she can't do it and has to do something that she might have a flair for but isn't really interested in. Also she cannot touch her capital until she is 35! I wonder how much influence her stepmother had in this in a sort of 'if I'm not getting it nor are you' way. When she first begins teaching at the annexe it seems to be a bit more informal than at the main school but then after the war she is expected to teach girls of all ages at the main school. I wonder if she felt trapped - if Madge and Miss Annersley hadn't tried to keep her close would she have continued to teach? If she really hated it that much why didn't she go and join the forces during the war? Also where does she live in the holidays? We know from references in Exile that she stays with the Russells but there are no mentions of exactly where she lives and that also could have fostered resentment in her. All in all a very complex character and I would agree the one probably most like EBD herself.

 


#9:  Author: KathyeLocation: Laleham PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:00 am


I have to admit I'm not a huge Grizel Fan, I felt really sorry for her in the first few books, but by the time she is head Girl even as a child I got annoyed by her, re-reading them as an adult, I can't stand her until Reunion when she seems to have finally woken up to the fact that only she can make herself happy and has to take charge of her own life. I know that she really wanted to train for PT and wasnt allowed, but she then uses this excuse to warp her every thought and doesnt even try and make the best of the situations she is in, I know it was very difficult to do anything against parents wishes if they were holding the purse strings, but after she is 21 she could have done something other than teach, obviously it wouldnt have been her "ideal" job, but how many of us end up doing the things we really want to do ?? She continues teaching despite the fact that she hates it, takes it out on everyone else, wallows in her woe is me I wasnt allowed to train for PT year after year after year, that is her choice and people like that tend to wind me up, as you don't always get what you want, GET OVER IT It almost seems like she enjoys wallowing in her self pity and it takes setting fire to Len to wake her up a bit. I always thought it was a shame that Deira her so called friend used her so badly as there is nothing worse than being betrayed by someone who you have thought a friend for years. So I like her in the end, but I spend most of the books wanting to shake her and tell her to get a hold of herself and there are other options if she wanted them, as was said above she could have gone of and done all different sorts of war work and made a whole new life for herself had she wanted to, but she seems determined almost to suffer. As if this makes a point to her father and step mother, they obviously don't care if she is happy and yet she seems determined to be unhappy.

 


#10:  Author: AllyLocation: Jack Maynard's Dressing Room!! PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2004 12:55 pm


When I was younger I didn't have much time for Grizel as it was hard to understand her and get to know her as a character. However, my opinion has changed as I have grown older and I can see how EBD treated her.One of the major things that has affected me is this quote from School
Quote:
By slow degrees the wilful, high-spirited child gradually became a frightened, nervous creature, who did as she was bidden with a painful readiness.
It feels clear to me that Grizel suffered and awful lot as a child with her father and step-father and that EBD wanted us to know this, and perhaps she wanted to change things for her. EBD's attitude to Grizel is mixed. She is the one to suffer the first major punishment given by Madge, yet she becomes Head Girl and by the end of that book you do feel that EBD currently likes her. She even brought her back to reappear briefly in Rivals and then she comes back to teach. After this she just isn't mentioned at all for ages except that brief comment in Exile about her being jealous of Robin and Joey. I don't remember previous comments like this and it just seems that at that present time EBD just doesn't like Grizel and is irritated by her. After this Grizel is barely mentioned in the English books despite being now part of the main school and other ex-pupils such as Hilary Burn and Gillian Linton have a much more prominant role.She is finally able to start again with a new life in Carola but not before she harms Len. It seems a very cruel way for her to go but, then again she had been at the school a long time so it did need something big to shake her up and remove her. What is sad is that her time in New Zealand also brought dissapointment and you never feel that she is allowed to settle and be truly happy.I often wonder what happened to EBD for her to want to bring Grizel back. She had obviously forgiven her character a lot in allowing her to marry a doctor and settle down in Switzerland, though she still had to suffer a further accident!!Sorry that this has turned into a resume of Grizel's life through the books!! I do think that her financial position is used too much as an excuse. She still had the background and support of the school, which should have softened her more, but she must have also felt unloved and trapped by her family for most of her life.

 


#11:  Author: AlexLocation: Hunts, UK PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 12:44 am


Basically Grizel is abused by her stepmother, especially looking at Ally's quote, that is what it comes down to. This explains a lot about her.I think she made a surprisingly good head girl. Also I think that school was the only place where she was ever happy, so I can understand her ending up staying there teaching, even though she could have got out during the war, in the hope that she would be happy again. Besides, sometimes it is easier to go along with something, even if you don't like it. It is a bit strange how all you hear for a few books is that she's a grumpy teacher, rather sarky, and then suddenly, she turns into this mad, bitter woman.Neil's proposal is much, much better than Reg's.

 


#12:  Author: PadoLocation: Connecticut, USA PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 1:27 am


I've always had a sort of split reaction -- disliked "Grizzle" (which is how I pronounced the name for ages) who was difficult and sarcastic but liked/felt sorry for "Grizelle" who every now and again let her essentially nice personality show through. It wasn't until "Reunion" that I really found myself liking her as a character, prickly as she is. (Wonder why it's OK for Bill to be sarcastic but not Grizel?)

 


#13:  Author: Rachael PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 10:02 am


Pado wrote:
(Wonder why it's OK for Bill to be sarcastic but not Grizel?)
I suspect it's because Bill knows when and to what extent to use it i.e. going easier on more sensitive souls ... Grizel probably wouldn't have appreciated such niceties ... (Though Bill can do little wrong as far as I'm concerned! Wink Rolling Eyes )

 


#14:  Author: LizBLocation: Oxon, England PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 6:12 pm


Like Pado, I pronounced the name 'Grizzle' for years - it wasn't until I read Reunion that I discovered it was supposed to pronounced any different. Even now, I have to correct myself at times. I do feel sorry for Grizel. Her life was such a series of ups, downs and uncertainties, aside from her relationship with her father and stepmother. (Does she have a name other than Mrs Cochrane? I think it's so sad that the best Grizel can do at a name for her is 'Steppy'.) I think part of her misbehaviour in School at was partly a desire to impress others, hoping to gain acceptance. At the beginning of the CS she was an important person, because there weren't many girls and as one of the English girls the girls of other nationalities looked to her for leadership and advice on how to be an 'English school.' As the school got bigger she became more lost in the crowd of girls, noted more for a sarcastic tongue and a mention of being big-headed when she was unofficial sports prefect. Her escapade at the beginning of Head Girl is almost like her self-conscious is trying to destroy her chances. I'm so glad that she got given another chance, after all, it did happen outside of school time and who knows what some of the other head girls might have got up to off the premises! (drabble anyone?) Wink She later proves her worth when she and Jo go after Cornelia and the madman. And again at the hotel fire when she uses her skirt and implicitly her body to sheild Robin from the flames. When she comes back to teach at the Annexe, she's again a person of importance as it's a small branch of the school and she and Juliet as old girls are once more looked to for leadership. Then after Exile the Annexe is no more and she's once again just one in a group of many old girls who are teachers, but a lot of whom (Gillian Linton, Hilary Burn) weren't actually at school with her and contemporaries of hers - she's kind of one in the middle between the older staff, and the younger old girls. At the same time, she's seeing her friends settling down happily in married life and becoming more absorbed in their families, so having less time for her, or she's separated from them because of the war. As the school grows bigger she becomes less important - she's just the music mistress, with a lesser role to play than if she were a form mistress (don't think I recall reading of her as having a form of her own) - mainly apart from playing the piano for Mr Denny's singing lessons and teaching piano she seems to have hardly anything to do, with all that time on her hands to brood, it's no wonder she gradually becomes bitter. The incident where she sets fire to Len was an ACCIDENT although you would almost think it was on purpose from the reaction it gets. Ok, so she was careless, but it wasn't something she did on purpose. It's a shame she leaves after that so no-one realises that she's carrying the burden of guilt for that around for years - if she could have been helped to get it out of her system that would have been so much better for her. But she goes off, and does the music shop thing with Deira, and then gets let down again by her old friend - or so it appears to her, Deira might not have appreciated how Grizel felt at the time, as I imagine her to be quite a reserved person. I like the gradual building of the relationship with Neil Sheppard - the way he treats her so gently on the boat for example - and her eventual realisation of how she feels. It is a very convenient coincidence that he's offered a job at the San, but a minor one in terms of EBD coincidences. She deserves to be happy, and I'm glad she is in the end, but it's a shame she almost fades away again, with only occasional mentions after that, after all at that point she's not at the other side of the world, so could have more involvement than to fulfil her role as a doctor's wife and produce a child! Although as she didn't really like teaching music, maybe it's better that she didn't go back to the school. Liz

 


#15:  Author: CazxLocation: Swansea/Bristol PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2004 6:31 pm


I can never make up my mind about whether I like Grizel or not. I do feel sorry for her throughout the series, her life was hard. Yet she makes problems for herself by not thinking, i.e. running off to see the falls when she had been told not to. I think she was much better as Games prefect than Head Girl, and think that Gertrude would have been a better HG than her as she seems to be the voice of reason at the prefects meetings. Deria burning the book with her Granny's letter in always makes me cry and I do feel a huge amount of sympathy for Grizel at that point. I like the way she comes back in Reunion and feel that she does redeem herself there, though it is still tragic to find out that she still beats herself up over the accident with Len.

 


#16:  Author: JennieLocation: Cambridgeshire PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 6:07 pm


Yet one of the things that strikes me is that Grizel is in fact no more stupid and disobedient than Jo is as a schoolgirl. so Grizel went to the Falls when she had been forbidden to do so. Jo deliberately sneaked out of school to go to the ice carnival, had an accident, and had to be looked after. So why could Jo be forgiven for her disobedience when Grizel couldn't be?

 


#17:  Author: MihiriLocation: surrey england PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 6:22 pm


I feel really sorry for Grizel. It must have been horrible for ehr to feel so completely unwanted and unloved. At the same time I don't think this excuses her behaviour. However I think it's very unfair that she is portrayed as such a horrible person. She has her faults, but so does Joey and she is portrayed as being fantastic - her faults being fondly looked on. I also dislike the way that her being matter of fact is laughed at a bit and Joey's dreamy attitude preferred. Its always important to have mtter of fact people around!

 


#18:  Author: VikkiLocation: Sitting on an iceberg, freezing to death!!! PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 7:28 pm


Jennie wrote:
Yet one of the things that strikes me is that Grizel is in fact no more stupid and disobedient than Jo is as a schoolgirl. so Grizel went to the Falls when she had been forbidden to do so. Jo deliberately sneaked out of school to go to the ice carnival, had an accident, and had to be looked after. So why could Jo be forgiven for her disobedience when Grizel couldn't be?
I suppose part of that could be attributed to the fact that when Jo snuck off tio the ice carnival she was just thirteen, whereas Grizel was nearly eighteen, if not already that age when she ran off to Schauffhausen, and could therefore be expected to have a little more common sense.

 


#19:  Author: Kathy_SLocation: midwestern US PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 8:02 pm


I think that she was forgiven running off at the time -- after being raked over the coals of course. At the end of Head Girl, all was very well. It's only later that EBD decides she should be "hardened" again, poor girl. Most of the time I do sympathize with Grizel -- except in the idea of wanting to be a P.T. mistress, since I always loathed the subject in all its forms. And it's not clear to me why she'd be more patient teaching P.T. than music! (Of course in my experience, impatience went with the territory among phys ed teachers. At least when it came to total klutzes like myself.)

 


#20:  Author: KateLocation: Ireland PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 8:07 pm


If I remember correctly, Joey tries to take part of the blame for Grizel running off, which I thought was quite unfair considering the age gap. Grizel should have had the common sense to ignore her. I do feel sorry for Grizel as a child, but as a grown woman, I lose patience and think "get over it!" Other people have worse things to get through. I wonder what she'd be like if she had therapy. Smile

 


#21:  Author: MihiriLocation: surrey england PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2004 11:33 pm


Kathy_S wrote:
And it's not clear to me why she'd be more patient teaching P.T. than music! (Of course in my experience, impatience went with the territory among phys ed teachers. At least when it came to total klutzes like myself.)
Maybe EBD meant that she'd be more patient because she enjoyed it.

 


#22:  Author: DawnLocation: Leeds, West Yorks PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 2:29 am


Mihiri wrote:
Kathy_S wrote:
And it's not clear to me why she'd be more patient teaching P.T. than music! (Of course in my experience, impatience went with the territory among phys ed teachers. At least when it came to total klutzes like myself.)
Maybe EBD meant that she'd be more patient because she enjoyed it.
Maybe she would have had more opportunity to work off her temper by giving the hockey ball a good whack!

 


#23:  Author: NicciLocation: UK PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 7:22 pm


I generally like Grizel, except when she's actually nasty and unpleasant which occurs sometimes when she is younger. Most of the time she is just heedless and thoughtless towards others, the latter of which is fairly understandable when you consider the way she was treated by her father and steppy. In her early life she wasn't exactly swarming in good examples of kind behaviour.I think a lot of the reason why she comes across as so unpleasant is that as a comparsion to Jo who is always loving everyone regardless, Grizel will only openly love people who have made the same effort towards her - for example, Cookie, her Grandmother and in many ways Madge. With the way she was treated by Mr and Mrc C it's no wonder she doesn't trust people. Madge surprises me though. Most of the time you get the feeling the Madge understands and sympathises with Grizel more than anyone else - and demonstrates this in the way she always wants to put her on the right track and give her chances to do better (ie. making her HG). However, every now and again, she acts in complete opposite to this and frankly, its no wonder that Grizel is so messed up in the head.By the time Grizel is an adult, you get the feeling that yes - she's had hardship, but she should deal with it, move on and change for the better. But then you get the whole thing about Grizel's time in Australia, which is never fully explained in the books, but which tells you that once again she has been severely disappointed. Which is why, I proclaim widely and loudly, Neil Sheppard is an absolute darling. And frankly, I don't care what kind of coincidence it takes to get them together. From the moment he meets her on the boat, he is so sensitive and caring, without knowing the first thing about her - and its probably the first time that anyone has ever treated Grizel in this way - usually people either don't like her or pity her because of her experiences.

 


#24:  Author: PadoLocation: Connecticut, USA PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 2:11 am


Kate's notion of therapy is right on the money, if you ask me. Grizel certainly has a difficult path to follow, and nothing she does seems to make it any easier for herself. Does the hardcover of Reunion give any more detail on Deira's actions than the paperback does? I can easily imagine G developing such a thick protective armor that D (and everyone else) never knows what she's really feeling.

 


#25:  Author: ellendLocation: Bow, London PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 6:13 pm


I agree with much that has been said. As for why couldn't Grizel just accept her first choice of career wasn't possible, as her father wouldn't pay for the training and turn to something else, I think this arises from her upbringing. In some ways the adult Grizel was still trying to win her father's approval or love, as she had as a child by doing what he wanted to do, even though she wanted to do something else. She'd been brought up in a comfortable upper middle class household and if she didn't comply she'd lose that comfort. Despite her early adventures, I don't think Grizel was independent enough to actually want to strike out on her own and leave her comfort zone of the school. Because of her upbringing had been unbalanced, she lacked a deep inner self-confidence to strike out alone. Indeed, in writing this, I've begun to wonder if the damage 'Steppy' inflicted was to make Grizel feel she didn't deserve the good things in life and that she was worthless. Therefore, she could do stupid things and the consequences to her didn't matter. Someone else said she'd been happy at the school and certainly at the Annexe would have been very important, but once the school resumed she was limited to music/piano teacher and also with new colleagues, who were 3-4 years younger. In many academic schools the musci teachers are regarded as almost second class, especially as Grizel didn't have a degree unlike many of her colleagues. I suspect Grizel had assumed that she could marry to escape teaching, but by the time she's 23 or 24 there's no-one on the scene and Joey, who's only 20 is engaged. Therefore Grizel's bitterness is the realisation that even her younger friends are getting married and she's not even, as far as we know got anyone special. We're told during Island(?) that Grizel is still very attractive, although looking older than her years, when she's mid-30s(?). So it wasn't her looks putting people off, but instead her personality her disatisfaction with her life, perhaps even a belief that she's not good enough to have a 'normal' life and marry. I agree that Grizel would have had the opportunity to leave the school during the war years and undertaken war work, but during Gay Madge and Nell say they don't want her to go as they are worried about what she'd do. Thinking about it now, I wonder if they they Grizel would go into self-destruct mode either drinking or sexual activities that would ultimately confirm her sense of worthless. Grizel had obviously reached a point in her life where she wanted to break the pattern and move on. Deira's letter offered a complete change, but she was again frustrated by her step-mother, so her temper and carelessness with the match is understandable, although it shouldn't have happened. I thinnk the music shop probably gave her a greater sense of self-worth and that she could succeed and provide comfort to others, eg Diera's daughter by playing and also providing Diera with much needed friendship. I expect, Diera didn't realise for ages how Grizel felt about the chap and anyway if he wasn't interested in Grizel, Diera turning him down wouldn't make him want her. But I can understand how this revived feelings of uselessness and lack of self worth, for yet another time Grizel's love had been re-jected. With the death of her step-mother, she's now free of all the past baggage and can final move on, without having someone judge her actions. I hope the above makes sense, as it is all a bit stream of consciousness.Ellen

 


#26:  Author: NicciLocation: UK PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2004 10:09 pm


ellend wrote:
I agree that Grizel would have had the opportunity to leave the school during the war years and undertaken war work, but during Gay Madge and Nell say they don't want her to go as they are worried about what she'd do. Thinking about it now, I wonder if they they Grizel would go into self-destruct mode either drinking or sexual activities that would ultimately confirm her sense of worthless.
Hmm, interesting point Ellen. I never really considered that, but I remember the conversation now and I wonder if you could have hit the nail on the head.

 


#27:  Author: nikkieLocation: Cumbria PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2004 8:45 pm


Nicci wrote:
Which is why, I proclaim widely and loudly, Neil Sheppard is an absolute darling. And frankly, I don't care what kind of coincidence it takes to get them together. From the moment he meets her on the boat, he is so sensitive and caring, without knowing the first thing about her - and its probably the first time that anyone has ever treated Grizel in this way - usually people either don't like her or pity her because of her experiences.
I agree he is a much more realistic man-in-love although not sure about all the coincidences when they get together.

 


#28:  Author: MiriamLocation: Jerusalem, Israel PostPosted: Sat Dec 18, 2004 10:26 pm


I 've just been reading some of the books which dealt with this era, and I realized that Grizel only spent one year in Florence - and during this year she visited the CS. I would have thought her course there should have been more than just one year. She also carries on studying with Herr Anserl when she returns to the CS. It's as though she really can't function properly at this stage of her life unless she has the very strong supportive background of the CS behind her. At the end of Head GIrl she has absolutely no idea of teaching, but by the middle of Jo Of, it is established that she will come back to teach at the Annex - and considering there were only two teachers at the Annexe, she can't have taught just music. I can't help thinking that once she had been away for a few months, she realized that she needed to be back there in order to feel happy and connected to her environment in any way, and was willing to compromise on not having wanted to teach, in order to be back there.

 


#29:  Author: Chalet School Fan PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:04 pm


I really don't like Grizel. She is such a drip, and always miserable. Then she goes and gets in a strop about something. She doesnt have to be that moody!

 


#30:  Author: LesleyLocation: Allhallows, Kent PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:38 pm


I think Grizel had a lot to put up with. She lost her mother and her grandmother, her father didn't want her, her step-mother verbally abused and bullied her. She was sent to boarding school only as a way of getting rid of her. While at the school she did nothing that was any more dreadful or terrible than any number of others, including Joey Bettany, and while she did have a temper and a sharp tongue -so did Margot Maynard who was infinitely worse. Yet she was always treated far more harshly than them - every time she is described it is with the 'hardness of her character' and she is known for her short temper. She was never given the chance at a full reformation. She was thwarted in her true wish for a career as a Games Mistress, for no good reason other than that her father wanted a return for his 'investment' in Music - quite why he should care when he'd spent most of her life ignoring her, I can only guess. Finally she is given a chance to start again, with a good friend and a new business in a different country, only to be thwarted again - this time by a combination of a ridiculous will and a vindictive step-mother. When we see her again it is when she is physically and mentally exhausted, has had a major estrangement with a close friend - deira - whether it was because they both loved the same man is only conjecture - but whatever it was enough that she was on her way toward a complete breakdown. Regardless of how much her manner may rankle, I believe she had a great deal to have to cope with, and her personality was such that she would tend to harbour and brood about things - hence her still worrying about an accident eight years later.

 


#31:  Author: Chalet School Fan PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 8:31 pm


Mmmm

 


#32:  Author: JennieLocation: Cambridgeshire PostPosted: Wed Dec 22, 2004 6:05 pm


I think that EBD decided that she wanted a real comparison with Jo, so she wrote Grizel's character. For someone who believed in tempering justice with mercy, she had very little pity for Grizel.

 




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